Author Topic: MPII/III spoke pattern  (Read 9291 times)

Offline OCD

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MPII/III spoke pattern
« on: June 15, 2015, 06:45:31 PM »
I've noticed in pictures of MPII/III/Vector hub motors, some have 'paired' spoke holes and some have evenly spaced spoke holes. Is this a design change or a random occurrence? If 'paired' is the new standard, how would you calculate the spoke length when changing to a rim with a different ERD?

Thanks.

Offline OCD

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Re: MPII/III spoke pattern
« Reply #1 on: June 16, 2015, 05:08:26 AM »
The spoke length calculator on ebikes.ca takes this 'pairing' into account if you enter MPIII into the motor info.

http://www.ebikes.ca/tools/spoke-calc.html

Offline Bikemad

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Re: MPII/III/4 and MP5 spoke pattern
« Reply #2 on: June 16, 2015, 03:47:21 PM »
The spokes on the MPII, MPIII, MP4 and MP5 hubs all have the same paired holes, but the MPII had a slightly wider distance between the flanges.
A different flange spacing measurement can be manually entered to match your particular hub if necessary, but I would expect the default 22mm width to be close enough for most applications.

 The idea behind the paired holes was to reduce the spoke angle at the rim to the angles typically found in conventionally spoked wheels:



This has greatly reduced the major problem that many hubmotors suffer from with spokes bending and snapping due to the nipple not seating correctly inside the rim:



Here you can see how badly the spokes were distorted on the original Magic Pie:



Magic Pie II, III, 4 and 5 hubs with laced rims all use the same paired hole measurements.

Using the ebike.ca spoke calculator, select the "Magic Pie 3" hub making sure the "Cross Pattern" is set to "0"  and I suggest you also fit the spokes with the elbows on the outside of the flanges for better lateral strength as shown here:



If you have an original Magic Pie with the longer crossed spokes, make sure the Paired Holes checkbox is left blank and the Cross Pattern is set to "1".

If you are fitting a new rim to a Magic Pie Edge or a Smart Pie, you would have to carefully measure the required parameters and then select the "Custom Hub" and enter the custom measurements.

If your rim is not listed in the dropdown options, you will have to measure and then enter the correct ERD:



I much prefer the spoke elbows on the outside of the flanges with the heads on the inside as shown here:



This also helps to alleviate flexing and fatigue of the unsupported spoke elbow at the flange attachment:



Alternatively, you can use spoke washers under the heads of the spokes to eliminate the gaps:





Which should hopefully prevent this from happening:



I also recommend using Sapim butted spokes if possible for additional strength and durability:



I hope this answers your original question and also helps with your spoke measurements and wheel assembly.

Alan
 
« Last Edit: May 17, 2020, 12:48:52 PM by Bikemad »

Offline OCD

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Re: MPII/III spoke pattern
« Reply #3 on: June 28, 2015, 05:52:52 PM »
Thanks for your reply Alan:

I'm planning to run 19" moped rims with 2.75 motorcycle tires, no more flat tire worries and better all weather traction. I've been running my Pro 901's on 3000 watts for years, now it's time to test the limits of the MPII. The e-bikes.ca calculator is more sophisticated than the one I was pereviously using, but the idea of the paired holes does help to decrease the bend angle where the spoke leaves the nipple when under tension in a built wheel. The spoke holes of the moto wheels have a raised dimple to allow for greater spoke angles. Will let you know how it goes.



(the other) Alan
« Last Edit: June 28, 2015, 11:55:20 PM by OCD »

Offline AdamB

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Re: MPII/III spoke pattern
« Reply #4 on: September 22, 2015, 07:24:30 PM »
Does this all apply to the MP5 also?

Offline Bikemad

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Re: MPII/III spoke pattern
« Reply #5 on: September 23, 2015, 08:27:33 AM »
Yes, this does also apply to the MP5 as the hub is exactly the same as the MP4, it is just the Bluetooth support of the controller that is different.

Alan