Charger schematic or fix.

[Lanchon]

> I only say do what the sticker says because I'm not going to say don't do what the sticker says.

I will. after all I can say whatever I want and still anyone who hears me will themselves be responsible for their actions.

that said, there's a whole forum saying that chargers come with reverse polarity. and people tell this person it's absolutely safe to plug the charger without the battery (and btw, not the other way around, they say). plus even the guy sending the charger to this person recommends testing polarity before plugging to the battery.

but this person decides to ignore the forum and trust the label, a label placed there by the same band of incompetents that have shipped many chargers with reverse polarity (including one to his very own hands I believe). you have to wonder why bother to ask the forum in the first place.

well, live and let live, fine, no problem. you know, I'd never write a post like this one, except this person is now asking PaintingLoft for a refund:
http://goldenmotor.com/SMF/index.php?topic=367.msg3518#msg3518
go figure!

[biohazardman]

Another reason to tell people not to plug them in without a load is cuz if you want to make them real cheap you don't put anything in them to keep them from burning up if they have no load. Not only do they cost less to make but you can sell more too. So the voltage rises so quick and with nowhere to go it has to let the magic smoke out cuz it gets to hot not to.   Such a deal!!  Then again if you want to sell even more you can put nonstandard wire colors on or make your own new standards up.  We be cookin now.  Hard to believe how cheap people can be.  Even when very specific specs are written up they are sometimes ignored in China for the want of saving a few bucks and doing it on the cheap. These mistakes can ruin peoples lives if they put there financial trust in having it come out right and stay that way.  They can do very good work and I have seen it time and time again wish it were that way with these things of our addiction.

[pdonahue]

Update: 

This thread seems to be getting off track... I was looking for a way to fix all the charges that have blown up from hooking them up reverse polarity.  Has anyone else tackled this problem?

I was poking around the charger board last night and I found that the wirewound resistor (0.1ohm at the output which I assume is being used as a current sense resistor) is open circuit (likely overheated and acted as a fuse).  I'm hoping that was the problem.  I'm going to replace it tonight and see how it goes...    Fingers crossed...  I may try replacing the output diodes and MUR1660CT dual diode as well, since they likely would have been in the path until the resistor burned up and they would have had way more current going through them than they were designed to deal with.

Pete

[Leslie]

Update: 

This thread seems to be getting off track... I was looking for a way to fix all the charges that have blown up from hooking them up reverse polarity.  Has anyone else tackled this problem?

I was poking around the charger board last night and I found that the wire wound resistor (0.1ohm at the output which I assume is being used as a current sense resistor) is open circuit (likely overheated and acted as a fuse).  I'm hoping that was the problem.  I'm going to replace it tonight and see how it goes...    Fingers crossed...  I may try replacing the output diodes and MUR1660CT dual diode as well, since they likely would have been in the path until the resistor burned up and they would have had way more current going through them than they were designed to deal with.

Pete

Let us know how it goes

I'm keen to fix the ones I fudged. One forum say's many can be fixed by replacing the FET on the main output.

BTW you guys might know about this,

I put a 2.5 amp fast blow fuse between the battery and a 2 amp 36 volt SLA charger, would this work if there was a problem after the fuse? EG. a short or reverse polarity or did I waste my time?..

[Leslie]

Update: 



I found that the wirewound resistor (0.1ohm at the output which I assume is being used as a current sense resistor) is open circuit (likely overheated and acted as a fuse). 

Pete

I just checked that very resistor it was the same one we talked about in the controller thread. .1 ohm 4 band brown black silver gold. I haven't pulled it off the PCB but it tested dud and smell kinda funny.  The paint inst scorched though it looks a bit weird, The burnt smell is all over in this charger but that resistor looks like its goners.

Got to go to bed and will let you know what happens with it.

[Nicobie]

.

but this person decides to ignore the forum and trust the label, a label placed there by the same band of incompetents that have shipped many chargers with reverse polarity (including one to his very own hands I believe). you have to wonder why bother to ask the forum in the first place.

You know, I wonder why I asked also.

This the second GM charger that has failed on me. As I mentioned earlier in this thread, the first one I checked for polarity, it was correct, (and YES Lanchon, I am capable of reading a multimeter) then unplugged  the charger from the wall, hooked up the batteries, plugged it in the wall again and it blew up.

As to the remark about why follow the directions? I didn't the first time and the charger lost its smoke. I wasn't about to follow the advice of someone here who said that hooking up a multimerer backwards would cause the charger to fail.

I don't think it is unreasonable to ask for a refund when I specificaly asked if the charger worked. Obviously it didn't. However I do agree that it was unappropriate for me to mention this in a open forum before contacting the seller.

[Leslie]

Can you show us some pics EG. The old charger, colours of the wires. Tell us which one you put on what, your setup etc. Is yours a standard battery, ort is it customised.  Is the old charger designed for that socket.  The plug, you've given us nothing but your word on all this and to be quite honest your being aggressive.


People are trying to help you here.  I find it a little difficult to believe any one has sold you a bum charger and made it so it would blow up when you used it. that is a little whack.


The smartest people do the dumbest things sometimes.  like when you test stuff looking at it one way then turn it around and plug it in.  Oops.  sometimes it muddles me around I have to turn my head the right way just to be sure.. I used green and black once and it didn't matter how many times I tried to remember it I got confused and had to check the polarity. Theres put the multimeter leads the wrong way and oops I wired the wrong colours to my battery wrong to begin with I swear I got those colors right

You should check double check and quadruple check. There are so many things that can go wrong with electronics and only one way it can go right.  One bad move and it bye bye controller chargers hub windings yada yada yada...

There is no way in hell I would wire up a charger with out checking polarity on my home job if it just happened to look like the plug fit!

When I blew my chargers I rang Vin at AAEV a tad flustered but more concerned as to what the hell I did wrong.  It took me about 3 mins to discover my errors and I called him back and explained myself.  I told him I got my multimeter wired wrong was a little upset regarding the wrong colour coding. Thats life. He acted like a little bint about it and showed no sympathy towards me at all.  Oh it was like the sauce on the pudding in some ways...

My bad in the end, I had to drag myself to my feet dust my coat off and learn the hard way...

Some pics please.

[pdonahue]

I stopped by the Sayal electronics on the way home to pick up some diodes and they didn't have the MUR1660CT or 1N5408 in stock.  I picked up a pack of 1N5406 diodes which are the same as the 5408s except that they only have a reverse breakdown voltage of 600V instead of 1000V.  I decided that that shouldn't make a difference.  I had a 0.1 ohm 3W resistor kicking around from my old gainclone project. 

Before starting, I checked both the 5408s and the 1660, and they both appeared to still be working, but I decided it was best to replace them anyway.  So, I removed the green resistor and replaced it with the new 0.1 ohm 3W one.  Then I removed the 5408s and replaced them with the 5406s.  I plugged it in, and got 56V across the plug.  That seemed a little odd since I would have expected either 54V or 58V depending on whether the charger thought it was in float mode or fast charge mode, but I figured I might as well give it a try. 

So far, so good!!!  My battery (which started at about 49V after I got back from my ride) is now at 55.3V and the charger fan is blowing cool air out the side.  I still have my old battery charger as a backup, but I'm going to try using the newly repaired one for a week or so to see how it holds up.  Assuming that it is still working after a few days, I'll likely still replace the MUR1660 the next time I have an order at Digikey just to be on the cautious side.

I'll post another update if it breaks in the next few days.

Pete

[Leslie]

Pictures of what?

Red to red and black to black?  These chargers are wired blue = positive and brown = neg. This is a standard thing. I have been using an ebike for well over a year without problems other than this sh!t charger. I double check everything. The fact is these chargers are worthless and I've been ripped off twice.

If anyone is "a bit over aggressive" might I suggest that it is U.

Tell you what, why don't U post pics on how it should be done, then we can all wank on you about U're advice.

LOL OK mate you win.. 

Im just learning like everyone else in this trade. I post my findings as I learn, like a journal so to say. Its helped me a lot to do it that way because if I make an error there are plenty of better people here that can correct me as I learn.. It may just help someone in the future and I put a lot of effort into it...

A theory of mine is you cant learn anything if you think you already know it all.

Good luck with you refund!  Honest.

[Leslie]

So far, so good!!!  My battery (which started at about 49V after I got back from my ride) is now at 55.3V and the charger fan is blowing cool air out the side.  I still have my old battery charger as a backup, but I'm going to try using the newly repaired one for a week or so to see how it holds up.  Assuming that it is still working after a few days, I'll likely still replace the MUR1660 the next time I have an order at Digikey just to be on the cautious side.

I'll post another update if it breaks in the next few days.

Pete

Id say you nailed it buddy, great work there ive taken all that on board.  The voltage is a little low for fast charge is what your saying? Could the smallest of reduction of resistance to the adjuster leg of that 1660 fix that or is it a set voltage job?

My charger uses a 1650..  Ive been to the electrical store here and they are baffled .  My god my eyes are going I check it in sun light. I say 1620 that's a  MUR 1620.. roger .  ohh goody back to the store to fix my charger..



Thank you sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo much Pete!

Les

[Leslie]

Pete!  PETE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


ARRRRRRRGHHHHHH

You are a legend.

I just replaced the resistor with one off my old controller and she works a dandy..


Tested 42.5 volts on float and havnt used it to charge but I'm thinking its all good.

It was hard to get the resistor in through the holes you know so I soldered it on the back of the pcb with heat shrink around it.

Im going to mount it inside a new box.

Again thank you.  Now where is that other 36 volt charger.   

Edit:

Update:

I just put it on 3X12v 18ah (36v) tested voltage at 38.4 volts.  She's quick charging at 43.6 volts and rising.  You saved me and my family $80 AU so far.

Update 2:

Found the second SLA charger and the same goes with that resistor too.  Looks as though you saved us $160 AU now.  Going out with the Mrs tonight so will work on it tommorow...

[Lanchon]

> I don't think it is unreasonable to ask for a refund when I specificaly asked if the charger worked. Obviously it didn't. However I do agree that it was unappropriate for me to mention this in a open forum before contacting the seller.

I don't think its unappropriate for you to mention that in an open forum. but once you do you have to be ready to receive comments from the forum members. after all, if you wanted private communication you could have chosen that.

let me explain why I commented. I took your choice of public vs private communication to ask for a refund as a way to leverage peer pressure to your advantage and against PaintingLoft. (note that this is indisputable; this is how *I* took it, regardless of your real motives which I'll never know for sure.)

so for what it's worth, and in order to relieve pressure from PaintingLoft, I want to say that I disagree with you. I do think it's unreasonable of you to ask for a refund, and it's not obvious at all that the charger didn't work; on the contrary, all evidence points to you breaking it.

plus you clearly knew at the time of the buy that many of those chargers came with the polarity reversed, and you accepted that risk and bought it anyway. if you wanted a charger with guaranteed good polarity you should have bought a different product elsewhere.

PaintingLoft, don't feel any pressure from my side; if I were the seller, I wouldn't refund.

> (and YES Lanchon, I am capable of reading a multimeter)

I didn't call you any names, and I'm grateful you did the same for me. IMHO there's nothing wrong in not knowing how to use a tester, and I wouldn't mock anyone who didn't. my post was non-technical; it only had to do with the way you were handling a business transaction.

I can understand frustration and anger, and asking for a refund while your blood is hot. but please understand these things don't make your request valid.

fortunately you can probably fix both chargers easily. if not both, surely you should be able to fix at least one of them, so I think you'll be ok in the end.

[pdonahue]

Pete!  PETE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


ARRRRRRRGHHHHHH

You are a legend.

I just replaced the resistor with one off my old controller and she works a dandy..


Tested 42.5 volts on float and havnt used it to charge but I'm thinking its all good.

It was hard to get the resistor in through the holes you know so I soldered it on the back of the pcb with heat shrink around it.

Im going to mount it inside a new box.

Again thank you.  Now where is that other 36 volt charger.   

Edit:

Update:

I just put it on 3X12v 18ah (36v) tested voltage at 38.4 volts.  She's quick charging at 43.6 volts and rising.  You saved me and my family $80 AU so far.

Update 2:

Found the second SLA charger and the same goes with that resistor too.  Looks as though you saved us $160 AU now.  Going out with the Mrs tonight so will work on it tommorow...

Glad to hear it!!!  What part of Austrailia are you from?  I did a little cycle touring around the west side a few years ago and had a great time...  Found the roads a little rough so I turned around, went back to Perth and took the train across instead....  Beautiful landscapes and people the whole way...  All the best,  Pete 

[pdonahue]

So far, so good!!!  My battery (which started at about 49V after I got back from my ride) is now at 55.3V and the charger fan is blowing cool air out the side.  I still have my old battery charger as a backup, but I'm going to try using the newly repaired one for a week or so to see how it holds up.  Assuming that it is still working after a few days, I'll likely still replace the MUR1660 the next time I have an order at Digikey just to be on the cautious side.

I'll post another update if it breaks in the next few days.

Pete

Id say you nailed it buddy, great work there ive taken all that on board.  The voltage is a little low for fast charge is what your saying? Could the smallest of reduction of resistance to the adjuster leg of that 1660 fix that or is it a set voltage job?

My charger uses a 1650..  Ive been to the electrical store here and they are baffled .  My god my eyes are going I check it in sun light. I say 1620 that's a  MUR 1620.. roger .  ohh goody back to the store to fix my charger..



Thank you sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo much Pete!

Les

You should be able to use the MUR1620, MUR1640 or MUR1660 interchangably.

[Leslie]

I tried the other charger and I removed the 1620 some time ago.  It reads 1650  or really 1620 it's harder to read hence the mixup.  However the PCB is very frail and small on this 2 amp charger and I stuffed it up bad and the other regultor transitor is fried now tracks are melted.  the second charger is in the bin...

I think ill leave these suckers where they stay. The resistor did the trick. I need lower wattage iron for this stuff, im working with a crude 240v 30 watt nothing like the old 15 watt 12v I used 20 years back. Again thank you.