The pie Vs minimotor 24V Vs Mac 1000w

[DirtyGinge]

HiAll

Now here we go with another ginger rant full of facts figures, and mostly drunk typos....

Here is my experience comparing 3 completely different motors, for those of you who don't know which type to get.....

A little bit of history for those who don't know me....my daily commute is 50 Miles, so 250 miles per week no matter what weather ( apart form last monday...sorry, I am human(

Now I am currenlty re-doing my bathroom, so I have limited time to post, however will try my best, as long as you can be patient for each post to slot in as and when I can 

but here is a quick summary from my experience so far

the Magic pie.........yup alright with internal controller but rocks with an infineon controller....for the man who has no intention of ever cycling, but wants to "get away" with an electric motorbike

The minimotor........@ 250W...whats the point.....now up the volts to 48V@ 500W, now it becomes interesting....still you cant use below 10MPHm but after 10MPH, this little fella really unleases......................this is for the person who can cycle 12-14 miles, but wants to commute 25Miles........you will work a little, but its quiet ( over 10MPH), helps ( no hills or starts), and is very stealthy..you wont sweat, but your not going to get cold either ( if it lasts)

THE Mac 1000W......a strange mix of both above.....still testing, slighty bigger than the mini, sounds a little louder than both, very very torquey, freewheel ( use it or not, battery or not, its your choice)

more to come as I get time ( the little time between repairing the house and drunken abyss, about 25 minutes each day

[Andrew]

what's the highest amps and watts you've run the mini motor on?  and have you managed to source a metal gear replacement for one of the small inner gears?

[DirtyGinge]

Hi Buddy

Well whilst ive got a minute, ill tell you about the mini then ...but the full story for all as well

Well the mini is the GM factory 24V version....laced it up using some nice sapin strong ( I know, I just love these spokes)

Using a lyen mini monster =6 Fet controller.....lovely little controller measuring about 4 inches x 1.5 inches...mini that can output 25A @48V...

Well, due to the fact im going to kill this motor, I set up some simple rules in order to keep it living

1......Never use the motor under 8MPH
2......Always pedal more with feet uphill than the motor is imputting

went for my first ride @ 250W....start peddaling, throttle ( erm is the motor working,.......i think so ....erm...stop lift wheel, yes wheel spins)....so there you have it.....250W of power is erm.....underwhelming on any motor

right then, so drag out the 48V battery, setting up controller for 10Amp continuous, 30 Amp Phase ( very high I know, but the lowest phase the mini monster will do, will be fine as long as I follow the rules above)

right then......@ 500W..........this motor is noisy under 10MPH. like all geared motors, but after 10, well its a different machine....

10 mph, start to feel acceleration
15MPH, hmm yea, its driving me
with no peddaling, it can  sustain 19MPH, with pedalling 22MPH......I love this little thing , im getting a workout, and I can do my commute @ 25 Miles

So lets road test the mini for a couple of hundred miles....

[DirtyGinge]

ok, 100 miles in the bag....barely warm.....
Some of these commutes, I barely cycled, only to start etc, what a little pocket rocket.....(@500W, peak 750W)

after about 100 Miles, I start to hear a clicking on each revolution of the wheel.....hmm, check spokes, fine.....click gets louder....louder...ok I wonder if I have bamboozled the gears..time for a stripdown

So I find the problem.......GM in all its infinite wisdom, have used 6 bolts on the side that are too long for the holes they are meant to go in, so the cover ( holding the bearing), was never tight against the wheel, and after some miles, the bolt countersink has worn a little, the clicking was the cover sliding up and down....

The gears though, are mint ( but still warm even after an hour!!)..

Hacksaw out, cut 2MM of each bolt, back in the hole, and wayhay, motor is back to new.......no clicking.....its a nice little machine :)300 miles in the tank ...

Andrew...Ive not been able to source metal gears, but with duals, I would say you will have no problem at 10 amp cont 15 peak, certainly if you follow the rules above...


My general rule is that if you can hear the motor clearly, its working too hard...if its silent ( which it was above 12MPH), all is good

 so now the post arrives......mac shanghai 1000W rear

[MonkeyMagic]

>> Edit, posted elsewhere

[DirtyGinge]

thanks monkey, just thought I would do a nice comparison on all three motors here for all concerned....

( for those who havent seen marks post, please see here for more info)

http://goldenmotor.com/SMF/index.php?topic=3251.0

[MonkeyMagic]

thanks monkey, just thought I would do a nice comparison on all three motors here for all concerned....

lol no I posted here and then thought it was better suited in the other topic, so I deleted it from here and put it the other topic with more stuff.

I wanted to leave this one clean for the comparison!! haha

So take that back!! lol

[MonkeyMagic]

Actually I think Who42 would have some good input here with all of his builds

But he will probably post something about his new site instead lol

[DirtyGinge]

everyones welcome

The reason I make these massive ranting posts, is the one question everyone who starts to build an ebike asks.."what do I need".....sure a motor can do 20mph on a flat, but will it last for 1000 miles ?...im in a good position to tell people what works after 1000 miles at -10C, so rant I do ..

Disclaimer, all posts are personal opinions of a fat balding alcoholic......take advice at your own peril

[DirtyGinge]

So here is the comparison in size between the GM Minimotor and the mac 1000W rear, both same type of motor...geared freewheel etc, and here is the little fella attached to the trek "fat burner"

[DirtyGinge]

So, fitted the mac, with my "sapim strong" spokes to a downhill mavic ex721 rim......

Now the mac, and BMC motors for that fact, do have some issues with certain controllers, so make sure you investigate that your controller is compatable...

With my 6 FEt mini monster, I have set 500W con, 750 W peak on the GM Mini, and run this no problem, warm, not hot for 25miles....now the controller is limited, so should run the ~mac fine ?

Well, er...nope.....5 miles, the controller is almost too hot to touch, phase wire covers and connectors have melted ( bear in mind the same wire can output over 2000 watts on the pie), and the noise coming out of the motor sounds like a dentist trip...

Time to do this proper stylee


The donkey lends its 12Fet lyen controller for the day...anderson 75AMp poles on each phase..30 watt cont, 70 phase.....lets twist the throttle and ??
Wheelspin from standstill in my house...WTF,...straight off the line torque...and the noise is sooo much quieter than the 6Fet infineon, almost barely audible

[DirtyGinge]

So all is set for my commute in the morning....rain forecast....battery charged...ah yes, the british e-bike experience

top speed so far on the flat......30MPH, however the 12Fet has the 120% speed setting active, so lets see what we get tomorrow

[Andrew]

everyones welcome


Disclaimer, all posts are personal opinions of a fat balding alcoholic......take advice at your own peril

Ha ha ha!  I can second that quote as a fact! pmsl

....and I hope your Grand Prix commute tomorrow morning fares better than todays Canadian Grand Prix!!

[Bikemad]

So here is the comparison in size between the GM Minimotor and the mac 1000W rear

Hey Ginge, any chance of a slightly larger picture for those of us who don't own a microscope?

Alan
 

[DirtyGinge]

Here ya go...