Rigid power tools 18 volt batteries offer lifetime warranty

[erdurbin]

If you get a Rigid 18 volt drill, it comes with 2 batteries and a charger. Currently at Home Depot for 179. They are 2.5 ah each. You would have to wire them in series to get your 36 volts, but the great thing is that they offer a lifetime warranty. I am not really sure what has to happen to the battery for it to become unusable, but I am assuming if it doesn't hold charge, you send it to them for replacement. I will call Rigid tools this week sometime to follow up on this guarantee. This could be batteries for life on your e-bike!

[myelectricbike]

You also need to check and see if using them to power an ebike will void the warranty. 

Update... As I suspected, the Rigid lifetime warranty does not cover use for "...unintended purposes..." of which using the batteries to power an electric bike is one. 

In other words if and when the battery fails you have to make a choice between sacrificing your integrity and eating the cost.

[erdurbin]

No, you just don't mention it. If you leave the battery pack intact, there should be no problem. There is no way for them to know. I would think an ebike would use the battery just the same as a power tool. You are simply discharging and recharging.

[erdurbin]

LIFETIME SERVICE AGREEMENT FOR RIDGID® HAND HELD POWER TOOLS, STATIONARY
POWER TOOLS AND PNEUMATIC TOOLS
In addition to the 3-Year Limited Service Warranty currently included with RIDGID® Brand Hand Held
Power Tools Stationary Power Tools, and Pneumatic Tools, purchasers of these products may elect
for a limited time to receive a free Lifetime Service Agreement. To accept this Lifetime Service
Agreement, you must register your product and submit proof of purchase as described below. The
Lifetime Service Agreement provides the original owner of qualifying RIDGID® Brand tools a lifetime
of free replacement batteries, free service and free replacement parts subject to the limitations set
forth below.
The Lifetime Service Agreement is available free of charge, for a limited time commencing April 15,
2005, on all RIDGID® Brand hand held power tools, stationary power tools and pneumatic tools,
subject to the terms and conditions stated below. Customers have 90 days from date of purchase to
register tools for the Lifetime Service Agreement.
PROOF OF PURCHASE (RECEIPT AND ORIGINAL UPC CODE) WILL BE REQUIRED WHEN
REGISTERING.
REGISTER YOUR TOOLS THROUGH RIDGID.COM TO ACCEPT THE RIDGID® BRAND
LIFETIME SERVICE AGREEMENT
To accept the RIDGID® Brand Lifetime Service Agreement, you must register your qualifying
RIDGID® Brand Hand Held Power Tool, Stationary Power Tool or Pneumatic Tool within 90 days
after purchase. For expedited handling, register by logging on to www.ridgid.com, click on “Support,”
then “Product Registration,” and choose the appropriate product category to be led through the
registration process. You may also register by US mail - simply complete a registration form found at
point of purchase, then mail the card together with a copy of your store receipt and the original UPC
from the package of the qualifying product to: RIDGID® Hand Held and Stationary Power Tool
Technical Service, PO Box 1427, Anderson, SC 29622.
All registrations must be made under the name of an individual person. Within approximately 6-8
weeks after completion of the registration process, you will receive confirmation via email or US mail
that will include your Lifetime Service Agreement Identification Number. Keep track of this number as
you will need it in order to obtain service for your product under the Lifetime Service Agreement. A
Lifetime Service Agreement card will be mailed to you; this will also include your Lifetime Service
Agreement Identification Number.
Customers who purchased qualifying RIDGID® Power Tools between Feb. 1, 2004 and April 14,
2005 may register those tools by completing the on line form at www.ridgid.com or a registration form
(found at point of purchase) and also mailing in a copy of the store receipt to the address above.
Registration must be postmarked by August 12, 2005.
WHAT IS COVERED UNDER THE LIFETIME SERVICE AGREEMENT:
The Lifetime Service Agreement on RIDGID® Hand Held Power Tools, Stationary Power Tools and
Pneumatic Tools covers all worn parts in properly maintained tools, including normal wear items such
as brushes, chucks, motors, switches, gears and even cordless batteries in your qualifying
RIDGID®Brand hand held and stationary power tools; and replacement rings, driver blades and
bumpers on RIDGID® Brand pneumatic tools for the lifetime of the original owner. This Lifetime
Service Agreement does not apply to other RIDGID® Brand products.
HOW TO OBTAIN SERVICE DURING THE INITIAL 3-YEAR LIMITED WARRANTY
The Lifetime Service Agreement commences after the expiration of the standard RIDGID® 3 year
Limited Warranty. To obtain service for this RIDGID tool during the 3-year Service Warranty, you
must return it, freight prepaid, to an authorized RIDGID service center for hand held and stationary
power tools. You may obtain the location of the authorized service center nearest you by calling (tollfree)
1-866-539-1710 or by logging on to the RIDGID website at www.ridgidwoodworking.com.
HOW TO OBTAIN SERVICE UNDER THE LIFETIME SERVICE AGREEMENT
YOUR LIFETIME SERVICE AGREEMENT IDENTIFICATION NUMBER AND PROPER PERSONAL
IDENTIFICATION MUST BE PRESENTED WHEN REQUESTING SERVICE COVERED UNDER
THIS AGREEMENT.
To obtain service for this RIDGID® tool under the Lifetime Service Agreement, you must return it to
One World Technologies, Inc., attn: RIDGID® Hand Held and Stationary Power Tool Technical
Service, 1428 Pearman Dairy Rd, Anderson, SC 29625, freight prepaid, or take it to a designated
service center. You may obtain the location of the designated service center nearest you by calling
(toll free) 1-866-539-1710 or by logging on to www.ridgid.com. Not all authorized RIDGID® Brand
service centers have been approved to provide service under the Lifetime Service Agreement. When
requesting service under the Lifetime Service Agreement, you must present your Lifetime Service
Agreement Identification Number and proper personal identification (a valid driver’s license, passport,
or military I.D. or a valid Social Security card with photo ID). The designated service center will repair
or replace any part covered under the Lifetime Service Agreement, at our option, at no charge to you.
WHAT IS NOT COVERED
This Service Agreement applies only to the original registered owner and may not be transferred. This
Service Agreement only covers wear and tear or failure of the tool arising under normal usage and
proper maintenance. It does not cover any malfunction, failure or defect resulting from misuse,
abuse, neglect, alteration, modification or repair by anyone other than an authorized service center
for RIDGID® brand hand held, pneumatic and stationary power tools, any damage or malfunction
inflicted upon the tool by the user or other external sources, or any failure to comply with the warnings
and instructions in the operator’s manual.
Consumable accessories provided with the tool such as, but not limited to, saw blades, planer blades
and knives, insert bits, drill bits, grinding wheels and discs, cut off wheels, sand paper, safety glasses
and fasteners are not covered.
SERVICE AGREEMENT COMMUNICATIONS
All Lifetime Service Agreement communications should be directed to One World Technologies, Inc.,
attn: RIDGID® Hand Held and Stationary Power Tool Technical Service or call (toll free) 1-866-539-
1710
ADDITIONAL LIMITATIONS
This Lifetime Service Agreement is not a warranty; it does not alter or limit the 3-Year Limited Service
Warranty provided with your product, and it is not intended to create any implied warranties or rights
of any kind including any warranties of MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR
PURPOSE. Any such implied warranties are expressly disclaimed. To the extent they cannot be
disclaimed they are hereby limited to three years from the date of purchase. One World
Technologies, Inc. and RIDGID, Inc. are not responsible for direct, indirect, incidental or
consequential damages. Some states restrict limitations on how long an implied warranty lasts and/or
do not allow the exclusion or limitation of incidental or consequential damages, so the above
limitations may not apply to you. This Agreement gives you specific legal rights, and you may also
have other rights which vary from state to state.
PRIVACY POLICY
A detailed statement regarding measures to preserve the privacy of information submitted in
connection with communications regarding your RIDGID® Brand tool is available at www.ridgid.com.
This product is manufactured by One World Technologies, Inc. The trademark is used pursuant to a
license granted by RIDGID®, Inc.


So pretty much, you just have to register your product with all the required documents and you are set for a lifetime replacement guarantee. I hope that there is a good deal during the Christmas rush and I will probably buy a set. My SLA's should last until then.

[OneEye]

You will want to ensure your e-bike uses a similar cutoff voltage and power draw as the power tools they are designed for.  If you exceed the draw and depth of discharge their tools use they might have a reason to become suspicious of abuse.  As long as the e-bike community using the cells is small and discrete, you may be able to get away with this "under the radar" so to speak.  If you stay within those constraints, there shouldn't be any reason to think the packs are being used more than full time contractor.

There is a cold set of equations corporations use to make sure they don't lose their shirts to warranty claims.  I'm sure they are behind the lifetime warranty for this:

1.  A significant percentage of owners will fail to register the battery/tool, or will not be the original purchaser, or will lose the appropriate documents.

2.  Only a few tool users are going to burn through thousands(?) of cycles on a battery pack to the point where the battery falls below its specified end of life (is that going to be 80% of original capacity, or do they game this by saying it is something lower, like 60%?)

3.  A contractor who does use the tool enough to burn through a few thousand cycles will probably wind up destroying the battery pack in an incident that can be legitimately classified as abuse (dropping from scaffolding to concrete pavement, running over with a truck, etc), and voids the warranty claim.

4.  For those who do burn through that many cycles, a percentage will simply resort to replacing them by purchase rather than by running through the hassle of a warranty claim.

Overall they have to be pretty confident the number of claims that do come in will be small enough they can service them without undue hardship to the company's bottom line.  A bottom line that is hopefully larger due to increased market share amongst buyers.

It is a similar equation the corporations use when advertising a rebate.  I read a statistic that perhaps fewer than 40% of rebates are actually fulfilled.



Other than the warranty (which will probably be usable if you don't get caught violating its terms) what are the fundamentals of the cell chemistry and technology they are using?  It would be nice to know how many cycles the manufacturer is anticipating the cell life to be.

-Mike

[OneEye]

Thinking back on the DeWalt discussion, range is obviously an area for consideration.  How far do you intend to ride on these packs?  I'm assuming each pair is good for about 3 miles of range, so depending on your needs you may want 4, 6, 8, or even more of these packs.  The rated draw on the batteries may also drive how many packs you need to distribute the load and keep it from killing the packs (and being declared abuse, voiding the warranty).

Companies will also consider refunding the original purchase price to "repeat offender" customers who have too many warranty claims.  It allows the company to say they did everything reasonable to satisfy the customer, and reduces the red ink to a 1-time write-off.

Once again, the basics of the chemistry and technology used in the cells is an important part of the discussion.

[mustangman]

I agree with OneEye, I worked for for AutoZone and if we suspected abuse of the "lifetime" warranty the management team would simply refund the customers money and void the transaction. I have one question, are these NiMh , Lithium ion or LiFePo4 batteries?? The difference would greatly affect the life and charge rate of the battery packs.

[OneEye]

I haven't been able to find out from a few quick web searches what the chemistry/technology is.

If I were forced to make a guess I'd say it might be the e-moli lithium ion.  I think that chemistry was one of the first battery chemistries to make it into the 2000+ cycle range.  The company would be daft to back a product with a lifetime warranty if it couldn't make it into the thousands of cycle range.  Anything less and you call it a consumable, like the saw blade or drill bit.

-Mike

[myelectricbike]

Perhaps you should write both Rigid and Dewalt and ask them if their LiFePo4 battery warranty would cover using the batteries to power your ebike. Although you risk getting a negative answer you might also give Rigid and Dewalt the idea of not only developing a universal battery pack but to develop a hub motor specifically for their use. After all they are both in the business of making motors to power tools and have long since moved to BLDC PM technology. The hub motors they would manufacture and sell would most likely cost well over $500.

That way you can remain above reproach and the rest of us as well.

[erdurbin]

I bought a Rigid kit today and hooked it up for a few minutes. The batteries were not fully charged and I still got 22.5 mph freewheel speed. I am letting one charge while I am at work and will be charging the other later. Since I only have 2 18v batteries and they are rated for 2.5ah, I am not sure how long I can ride, but I will be taking a test ride and will post the results soon. Even though these seem a little more expensive than some other options, if you get 5 years out of them and then they replace the batteries even once, you get 10 years worth of batteries. I know it is a lifetime warranty, but who knows where e-bikes will be in 10 years.

[OneEye]

I'd love to hear your results.  How far can you go on the two batteries?  Please remember to include a description of the major variables, i.e. hills/terrain, how many stops you had to make at lights or signs, headwind or tailwind, what your cruising speed was, etc.  Peak amps and total delivered energy would be nice to know, but not everyone has the equipment to measure that.

-Mike

[myelectricbike]

Sure hoped you asked if the lifetime warranty covered using them to power your ebike.

[erdurbin]

It turns out, they work. I put 2 18volt batteries in series for my 36 volts. I only had the equivalent of 2.5ah, so it wasn't much to write about. The first hill I hit, the controller cut out from low voltage. I pedaled along with it and was able to use the motor again. I never really got about about 10mph (and that was downhill). I could only use about 1/4 throttle if I wanted to use any power. Full throttle was out of the question! It wouldn't last more than a second. I am wondering if I hooked up about 6 of these to give me the standard battery pack of 7.5ah. The sweet thing was it was very light! I had my old bike back. I guess I was only carrying about 3 lbs worth of batteries. The li-ion rigid batteries are very light, just wish they were more powerful. Staying around 6 mph, with intermittent hills, no wind, I achieved about 2 miles before the batteries went completely dead. If I did parallel, I would hope the voltage would not drop so suddenly on full throttle. If I ever gave it around half throttle uphill, the motor would "pulse" like it was receiving the power off and on. I didn't let this go on too long.

I know on my 12ah 26v SLA setup, when I hit full throttle uphill, the battery meter goes to half, but quickly jumps back to full after I let off. It was similar with the rigid pack, but I just couldn't get the torque or top end I needed.

[OneEye]

Sounds like the packs are limited in how many amps they can produce.  The controller wants to pull 20A from them and they drop voltage in response.  If we knew the fundamentals of the battery we might be able to guess how many packs it would take to satisfy the controller.  It also might tell us what the recommended low voltage cutoff is on the cell/pack, so we know if the controller is using a limited percentage of the available Wh in the cell.  I'm a bit surprised by your experience.  I would have assumed the batteries were rated for 10C draw for their use in a power tool.  What is the claimed Watt power on the drill's user manual?

The reported high draw rates available from the DeWalt / A123 cells is one of the things that has the different battery user communities excited.  They have been user tested at 30A for a single cell, and according to the manufacturer's spec sheet are rated at 70A continuous, 120A burst!  I'm pretty sure such high draws will reduce cycle life by a lot, but at 30A they ran for 1000 cycles at 100% depth of discharge, which is quite impressive.

Are you planning on returning these to the store, or did you buy them in part for the bike and part for the drill?

[erdurbin]

I think I will return under the 90 day policy. I just wanted to see what they would do. I didn't unpack anything except the batteries, so I'll just pack them back up and return. Maybe they will come out with a 36v soon and I can get a couple with the lifetime. If not, I will probably go for 4 dewalt 36v packs for 9.6ah wired in parallel. this will be around 450 dollars, but should give me plenty of range and 5 years worth of riding.