Controler MX36C-EB-D wiring diagram 36V, thumb throttle, reg braking, pedalec

[wepbep]

I just received my 2 packages with the DIY stuff...it's all there, the 28" rim with 250w motor, the controler MX36C-EB-D, 36V10Ah batterypack and charger, thumb throttle and twist throttle, reg braking, pedalec.

The exhange of the rear wheel 'chaincassette' or multiple freewheel(Shimano Tourney 6 gears) on the new wheelrim was no problem. I mounted them on the wiring side.

Surprisingly I'm not able to use the standard 28"/622mm tire because the GMrims are a bit bigger. I'll try to get my hands on 635mm tire and hope that fit's. 635mm is an older French size...but it's still used here.

I have a controller that says MX36C-EB-D and found diagrams of BLDC, BAC281(16.12.08) and BAC028x (newest) but found that none of these fit's my wiring does the job for me ?

I used the thumb throttle because the chrome ends of the twister would look misplaced on my bike.

I did a little test whith the BAC28x diagram and found:
- Throtle leds all work...and that is the only thing...

Summary of my questions:
- Which diagram must I use ?
- Which size of tyre fits the rim ?
- Do I need to install the pedalec to let the motor work ? Is there a way to bypass this function ?

/Marc-Germany
 

[wepbep]

- Which diagram must I use ?
I used the BAC281 like suggested else on the forum but:
1. Pedelec does not work. Connected or not.
2. Reg braking does not work, while braking motor stops but I feel no resistance in forward movement. That means no reloading...
3. I don't know if and where I have to connect the yellow and brown wire from the thumb throttle.

Results:
1. I have all three leds functional at the same time ?
2. I hear soft noise from the horn but no beeps.
3. I have a pink(C/12) and black(Z/8) wire with no connection.
4. I don't know if I have to follow the BLDC reg braking procedure....

- Which size of tyre fits the rim ?
I needed 635 tyres which I cannot buy in allroad. Also I needed a new hose because the nippel is too short for the new rim.

I'm getting dissapointed about the support...but maybe I'm just impatient ;-) and I don't want to be negative.
The weight is GREAT, the looks are GREAT, the driving with the minimotor is even better !

I've got a system that does exetly what I want, I can bike normally and only use the Esupport when I want or need it. On the really steep hillclimbs I just have to support the system a little.

2 be continued

[Sangesf]

- Which diagram must I use ?
I used the BAC281 like suggested else on the forum but:
1. Pedelec does not work. Connected or not.
2. Reg braking does not work, while braking motor stops but I feel no resistance in forward movement. That means no reloading...
3. I don't know if and where I have to connect the yellow and brown wire from the thumb throttle.

Results:
1. I have all three leds functional at the same time ?
2. I hear soft noise from the horn but no beeps.
3. I have a pink(C/12) and black(Z/8) wire with no connection.
4. I don't know if I have to follow the BLDC reg braking procedure....

- Which size of tyre fits the rim ?
I needed 635 tyres which I cannot buy in allroad. Also I needed a new hose because the nippel is too short for the new rim.

I'm getting dissapointed about the support...but maybe I'm just impatient ;-) and I don't want to be negative.
The weight is GREAT, the looks are GREAT, the driving with the minimotor is even better !

I've got a system that does exetly what I want, I can bike normally and only use the Esupport when I want or need it. On the really steep hillclimbs I just have to support the system a little.

2 be continued

From what I've read, the Pedelec needs to be "started" somehow...
From what I've read, there is no regen
Brown and Yellow wires are the button on the thumb throttle... when the button is pressed it completes the circuit to the brown/yellow wires... In other words, it's just a switch.
All three light are supposed to be lit up.  When the battery gets low and you use the throttle, the top green one will disappear, meaning battery is about to die.
Make sure the both wires (green/blue) are connected one to common ground (Z) and one to H on the controller.
The pink and black wires sounds like the Cruise Control connection to the controller.


Hope that helps a little.

[e-lmer]

I replaced my brake levers with new better ones, but that do not
have a switch for the brake.

I have heard rumors however, and need someone to try this.

It appears that if you apply the brakes AND throttle, you get
regen.

Can someone test this and let me know if this is true?

[Sangesf]

I have heard rumors however, and need someone to try this.

It appears that if you apply the brakes AND throttle, you get
regen.

Can someone test this and let me know if this is true?

If that's true, that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard.....  LOL


I'm going out for a 4 mile ride right now and i"ll let ya know.


EDIT:   Just came back from my ride.  NOPE! Break AND Throttle does NOTHING!

[wepbep]

I have heard rumors however, and need someone to try this.
It appears that if you apply the brakes AND throttle, you get
regen.
Can someone test this and let me know if this is true?

If that's true, that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard.....  LOL
EDIT:   Just came back from my ride.  NOPE! Break AND Throttle does NOTHING!

1. It's not a rumor, it says so in the reg brake setting for the BLDC controller. Which I don't have.
2. I think Perbear is right...unfortunatly one feels the motor moving backwards but the wheel is free moving forwards.
3. I especially order the regbraking because of our hills...so it has to work !
4. I'll wait for the GM-guys to give me the right settings, procedures and wiring because I don't want to do anythin false.
5. When I use my brakes the motor is turned off, release brakes gives the motor a boost when throttle was still used. I think that is also a problem. It should return to smooth starting ...

 

[Sangesf]

I have heard rumors however, and need someone to try this.
It appears that if you apply the brakes AND throttle, you get
regen.
Can someone test this and let me know if this is true?

If that's true, that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard.....  LOL
EDIT:   Just came back from my ride.  NOPE! Break AND Throttle does NOTHING!

1. It's not a rumor, it says so in the reg brake setting for the BLDC controller. Which I don't have.
2. I think Perbear is right...unfortunatly one feels the motor moving backwards but the wheel is free moving forwards.
3. I especially order the regbraking because of our hills...so it has to work !
4. I'll wait for the GM-guys to give me the right settings, procedures and wiring because I don't want to do anythin false.
5. When I use my brakes the motor is turned off, release brakes gives the motor a boost when throttle was still used. I think that is also a problem. It should return to smooth starting ...

 

Well the brake / throttle thing didn't work for me....   FYI.. they took off the regen statement on the pic of the new "magic" controller (the one I have).

I did not notice ANY braking effect when I used the brake and the throttle.... (but then again, I didn't put the brake hard enough to slow me, down, just enough to turn off motor.

[Perbear]

The pictures of the ebike in this thread indicate that it has the "minimotor". The minimotor I have bought from Goldenmotor has a freewheel to reduce drag at high speed. Motors with freewheel (one-way coupling) does not support regen since they are unable to brake the cycle.

That motors with freewheel does not do regen is is fairly basic knowledge, but unfortunately Goldenmotor does not state that their minimotor has freewheel and does not support regen.

My son has a 500W Goldenmotor direct driven hub motor. This motor works fine with the black regen controller (36V). Regen gives typically 10-20% longer battery range. Unfortunately, the 500W motor is about twice the weight compared to the minimotor. This additional weight could instead be used on a bigger battery, increasing the range even more than regen.

Perbear

[wepbep]

Thanks Perbear,

I already thought that it would be something like that...I'm disapointed that it's not the product I was looking for. Nor was it what I ordered...

When you want to use the system here you need reg braking. To replace cars motorcycles by biking you need the possibility to regenerate the battery. My local bikedealer told me he stopped selling Ebikes because it stop's when the battery is empty and people need to walk home.

I was looking for an alternative to http://www.bionx.ca/en/main/default/57.shtml .  But this certainly isn't it.

BionX has also a freewheel, reg braking is just using the motor as generator. So it should be possible...

[Sangesf]

Thankfully, I have TWO Motors on my E-bike, so I guess I'll have to move the controller to the second motor to get the regen...   Took me a week to wire the bike as it is now, looks like another week to re-route everything .

Or, I can resell the current front wheel mini-motor and purchase the larger non mini motor for regen.

[wepbep]

Maybe it's easier to mount 6 6V generators ? 

Anyway, my first mod to lower the weight:

[e-lmer]

In looking around, I have been reading that regenrative
braking gives very little back to the battery.

I think this is partly because much of the energy is lost
to heat and mostly because the battery should only be charged
at somewhere around 0.1C  (1/10th of the amps part of
the amp hour rating, eg:12AH=>1.2Amp)

It's unlikely that you can spend enough time on the brakes
to significantly charge the battery.

I suspect that most of the benefit of regen is the 'neato' factor.
BTW, Electromotive engines, like trains, dissipate the energy
through heat, they don't really save it.  (Dynamic Braking,
not Regeneratve braking.)

[floatbike]

The regenerative braking feature does work for me.  I have a mini motor with the new "magic" controller.  When the brake switch is closed there is a small delay before the regenerative braking begins to ramp up.    The regenerative braking definitely charges the battery.  I hooked a DVOM with a 10A capability between the battery and controller with the bike on a stand.  I used the throttle to accelerate the front wheel up to maximum speed, then I closed the brake switch.  I saw -1.8A on the DVOM, indicating that the battery was indeed being charged.  I have not hooked an amp meter up while riding to see what the maximum charging current is going down a hill with the regenerative braking on, but I intend to try this soon.

[Sangesf]

The regenerative braking feature does work for me.  I have a mini motor with the new "magic" controller.  When the brake switch is closed there is a small delay before the regenerative braking begins to ramp up.    The regenerative braking definitely charges the battery.  I hooked a DVOM with a 10A capability between the battery and controller with the bike on a stand.  I used the throttle to accelerate the front wheel up to maximum speed, then I closed the brake switch.  I saw -1.8A on the DVOM, indicating that the battery was indeed being charged.  I have not hooked an amp meter up while riding to see what the maximum charging current is going down a hill with the regenerative braking on, but I intend to try this soon.

What do you mean?


I was under the impression there is no regen....

When I hit the brakes, I see no slowing down of the wheel, nor do I feel it.  I was also told, that it only works if the throttle is on at the same time as braking... Is this true for you?

Someone also stated, that you can't do regen on the mini motor(s) because it has a free wheel.

Do you maybe have it set up so that REVERSE is ALWAYS shorted so that the mini motor is going backwards and THAT is why the regen is working for you?

When you look at your wheel, facing your bicycle, is the wire coming out of the hub on the left side or right side?


I'm curious to know why regen is working for you, but not for me 

[floatbike]

What do you mean?
I was under the impression there is no regen....
When I hit the brakes, I see no slowing down of the wheel, nor do I feel it.  I was also told that it only works if the throttle is on at the same time as braking... Is this true for you?

During regen the throttle does nothing.  It is only necessary to "short B to Z".   I only get one level of braking from the regen.  It takes a second to kick in, then it ramps up to a respectable level of braking. 

Someone also stated, that you can't do regen on the mini motor(s) because it has a free wheel.

The mini motor is an amazingly efficient little unit, with very little resistance to spinning when unpowered.   Pedaling my bike without using the electric power is very easy, almost no different than before I installed the mini motor kit.  I can see why someone might have thought that it had a freewheel mechanism in it.

Do you maybe have it set up so that REVERSE is ALWAYS shorted so that the mini motor is going backwards and THAT is why the regen is working for you?

I do not have the reverse feature (pin R to pin Z) hooked up.

When you look at your wheel, facing your bicycle, is the wire coming out of the hub on the left side or right side?

When I am ridding the bike, if I look down, the wires are coming out of the left side of the front wheel. 

I'm curious to know why regen is working for you, but not for me 

Are your brake switches hooked up correctly?  Does the controller cut out when you apply both brake and throttle?


Again today I did not bother to bring my DVOM with me when I rode the bike; I do want to check see how many amps I am getting back.  It must be 5 or 10A going down a hill, because the braking force I feel at 17mph is substantial.  I hardly have to use the friction brakes at all except to come to a complete stop.  Below about 5mph the regen braking is very light.  Also, because of the ramp up delay, the regen does not do much on unexpected quick stops.  All in all though I find the regen feature to be very useful.