GoldenMotor.com Forum
General Category => Magic Pie & Smart Pie Discussions => Topic started by: Magzy on August 24, 2010, 11:50:06 PM
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Hi there.
New user here with a quick question.
After hours of research and digging around the internets I have decided to join the Magic pie club.
I'll be buying one in the next few days.
However, I've already bought a Ping battery 48v 10AH
My question is, how easy is it to connect a Ping battery to the battery connection of the Magic Pie kit.
Ideally, I'd like to get the correct female connection for the battery side so I can solder it on and then connect/ disconnect the battery easily.
Has anyone done this previously who can tell me any tips and pitfalls to avoid?
Thanks,
M
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Hi there.
New user here with a quick question.
After hours of research and digging around the internets I have decided to join the Magic pie club.
I'll be buying one in the next few days.
However, I've already bought a Ping battery 48v 10AH
My question is, how easy is it to connect a Ping battery to the battery connection of the Magic Pie kit.
Ideally, I'd like to get the correct female connection for the battery side so I can solder it on and then connect/ disconnect the battery easily.
Has anyone done this previously who can tell me any tips and pitfalls to avoid?
Thanks,
M
Hi Magzy
Welcome to the GM forums.
Sorry to rain on your parade.
But
The ping 10 ah battery isn't enough for an MP IMO. Ping states you best suit his packs to 1C usage.
The MP can draw 20 to 25 amps at best.
Explaining 1C
If you have a 10 ah pack and you draw 20 amps from it when you take off and go up big hills you are drawing 2c
If you only draw 10 amps from a 10 ah pack its called 1C
If you draw 20 amps out of a 20ah pack its called 1C.
The bigger the amp hour AH pack, the bigger motor you can run. The C cell rating still doesn't change just the size motor you can run/ah..
What you plan to do is draw 2C from a 10ah pack. There is no reason you cant buy another matching pack and run two together.
Ping does rate his packs modestly and if those who use them stick closer to9 his ratings enjoy a long Ping pack life,
Contact Ping and tell him your plans he will agree with me and advise another 10ah pack.
I will go as low as a 15ah pack with a very light Magpie bike just used for a runner.
For heavy use either get the A123 cells, lipo, 20 ah ping or the GM pack. The only main stream lifepo4s that can do better than 2C are headway and A123 cells and maybe a few that don't come to mind.
Sorry to put a downer on your project but its better to find out now then run into some expensive problems later.
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Thanks for your quick response and advice.
This does indeed cast a shadow of doubt over my project now.
I specifically chose ping because of his reputation and quality (and 10AH is perfect for me as I only have 14kms to ride each day)
Ok, so looking at pings website for the 48v 10AH: http://www.pingbattery.com/servlet/the-13/48V-10AH-V2.5-LiFePO4/Detail
States the following:
Rated Discharging Amperage: 10 Amps
Max Continuous Discharging Amperage: 20 Amps
Maximum Discharging Current: 40 Amps
Discharging Cut-off Protection: 30 Amps
So yes, it's rated at 1c as you say but Ping states it will go up to 30 before it cuts out.
I only plan to travel 15km including up a couple of short (200m) moderate hills.
I'm fairly new at this but, according to my calculations, Producing 1000w (ish) (before losses) from the MP at 48v will draw approx 21Amps current from the battery?
(48v * 21A = 1008W)
If I somehow manage to up the amps to 29A (just before ping BMS cut off) then I'll produce 1392W out of the MP (1113W onto the road) after losses which would never be reached because you said that "The MP can draw 20 to 25 amps at best." in your post above.
Surely this is enough for getting 120kg's (me+bike and stuff) over 14km with 2 moderate hills in 200m ish length (picture the steepness and length of the museum steps that rocky runs up in Rocky with half the city's kids chasing him - that's how steep the hills I have to climb) - 20 to 30 second burst of amperage.
I know it's not great for the pack in the long term but I'm prepared to make this sacrifice for having a smaller battery and the cheaper cost. (which means getting mobile quicker)
If, for example, it only lasts 3 years instead of 4 then this is fine by me.
I just don't want to get the MP with the Ping 48v 10AH and on day1 find myself traveling at 10kmh with old people in wheelchairs overtaking me.
Having wrote all this I feel moderately better than when I started it - but please, tell me if my n00b-ness is still showing signs of n00b and I've missed something that I should be aware of ?
Cheers,
Magz
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Now you got me thinking about batteries and why I chose ping over GM here goes.
GM 12AH Battery
No cut off protection given
Max Discharge Current: 35A
Max Continuous Discharge Current: 20A
No rating given
Charging Cycles: >800 times
Cost inc postage = $511
est cost without case $ 495
Cost per AH =$41
Ping 10AH battery
Cut off protection at 30A
Max Discharge Current: 40A
Max Continuous Discharge Current: 20A
Rated discharge current 1C
Lifecycle of the whole pack:
>85% capacity after 1000 cycles.
Lifecycle of single cell:
>85% capacity after 1500 cycles,
>70% capacity after 3000 cycles.
(when used at <1C discharge rate and <1C charge rate)
Cost inc postage = $428
Cost per AH = $42
As you can see the cost per AH is practically the same. I've included postage because we all know these postage numbers are always massaged to make the product appear more or less expensive.
Not enough info regarding the GM batteries in order to make an informed choice.
A bit more technical info will set the expectation for the end user.
if it performs better than expected then the user is happy and the manufacturers reputation goes up.
if it performs worse then the user is unhappy and manufacturer reputation goes down.
However, here, the expectation of a GM battery can't be established except that it will last > 800 cycles
If I run my ping 48v 10AH into the ground and really hammer it and only get 800 cycles then I'd be happy with this. 800 cycles = 3.33 years (based on 240 working days and a charge each day)
Cheers,
Magz
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Rated discharge current 1C
Thats 10 amps.
There is more than cycle life you need to worry about, early failure could occur running a ping pack at 2.5C constant. Its a gamble youre willing to take, so thats ok. 8)
You may be easily lucky and it could do 1000 cycles, I really hope you do, cause I just bought a 20 ah and a 15 ah ping pack.
The GM packs for the quantity they sell I think seem to be fine. Many peeps are rocking around with them them. A few have come up a bit short. Some of the riders may have their maintenance skills upgraded. Or an odd failure.
I was shocked to hear GM sells 9000 kits a year. I wonder how many batts went out with them. We got 6 or so failures here and IMHO early failure rate is under the 1%.
The quality is picking up across the board for the companies that stay true to the cause.. Man it would be so easy to get screwed as a business buying Li cells.
I did some research
The BMS has to be pretty picky to protect the cells and can shut down if not balanced properly, the fix for this is leave the pack on the charger for a few days and she will come good. Interesting because I had to do the same form my SLA's every now and then.
I so wanted a GM pack with the battery box, but I and my other half between us can ride three 12 ah cycles a day every day. Even though I want to have two bikes I want each pack to last me a couple of years or more.
Man I got sick of SLA's two years of swapping out lead every 6 mths or so.
Yea maybe set your amps setting low on the Pie for the first 20~40 rides or so and bump it up slowly, Cycle them up a little, get them well balanced and jumpin before you hammer them,,
Hey good luck with the MP and ping pack.
I cant wait for mine. :D
Sincerely.
LESLIE
317537
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Hi Magzy,
Leslie is right, Start off gentle with your ping and don't completely drain it. Don't hammer it either. Try keep to the 1c rating for the first 5-10 cycles.
My ping has not had a single balance issue yet. All the lights come on at the same time after charging! and I must say, I didn't break it in too gently either! No one knows the longevity issues with these batteries, they could go for a lot more cycles than we think!
Going up hills I can pull 40 amps with my 20 amp ping, but most of the time on level ground it pulls 15-20 max! I have not run the battery empty yet. They are excellent batteries those pings.
I would say you will be fine if your round trip is only around 15 kms or so. I have managed to peddle for 15 Kms or so and only use 2 amps. Then use the motor for hills and when I get tird. If you use it like that you will be fine.
Did you buy the Internal controller pie? if so then It will probably not consume more than 15-18 amps MAX. around 750 watts @48-52 volts. So I don't think you will have to worry about that in the end, Pings batteries are more than capable of 1.5-2C, and again that's only peak, going up hills etc.
Regarding your battery connections. I just got 2x 50 amp Anderson connectors. But you could get away with 30 amp. I don't know what comes with the pie, It looked like an Anderson, but I chopped it off as I had 2 spares lying around! the 30 amp connectors look like this
http://www.powerwerx.com/anderson-powerpoles/powerpole-sets/30-amp-red-black-anderson-powerpole-sets.html
GM's 12 amp battery would have more than suited your needs. And not that much more expensive when you include shipping. However I think the longer lasting chemistry would be the ping!
Max Discharge Current: 35A(12AH)/60A(16AH)
Max Continuous Discharge Current: 20A(12AH)/30A(16AH)
They also have a BMS!
Anyway Magzy enjoy your ebiking it's fun, especially when you ride one for the first time! ;D
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The Magic Pie kit does not use more than 15amps anyway, the ping should be ok if you pedal on standing starts first.
I built a 48v 12ah battery that can put out 100 amps continuos and 160 amps peak based on lifepo4.
I really think that with an un-modded ping battery you would be fine if you don't mod the Magic Pie. To be on the safe side get a 15ah battery from one of the cheaper eBay battery pack sellers....works out about the same as the 10ah from ping.
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I really wouldn't buy a battery from any eBay seller, unless I knew their reputation. There are a lot of dodgy batteries out there, and eBay is where a lot of them are being sold.
Just use your ping and if you do need an extra battery, then buy another ping.
From reading other forums, there have been lots of problems with batteries not providing full capacity, and are having balancing issues.
Ping has a good reputation!
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I noticed for a while there were several ebay sellers
with pingping and ping123 like names, all purporting
to be "The only 'real' ping battery dealer."
You just can't tell. It's like those guys selling
gm products as their own.
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I almost got caught in that. :-\ There been a new wave of Ping Shady's on the net.
Will the Real Ping Shady please stand up. 8)
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Thanks guys this really helps me out a lot.
Having never rode an e-bike it's difficult to tell exactly what you will need until you get it and then test it out.
Did you buy the Internal controller pie?
I haven't decided yet. However, looking at the 15-18 amps for an internal controller seems a bit low for me.
Although 18A * 48v = 864W into the motor and 691W onto the road continuously (after 20% losses in the motor)
Now, to put this into some sort of perspective, Lance Armstrong can ride up the french alps generating about 500w of power onto the road for 20 minutes, something a typical 25-year-old could do for maybe 30 seconds.
Soooo, my question is, what is the amperage of the GM external controller out of the box? (nothing on the GM website indicating this)
Also, can the amps limit of the internal and external controllers be increased by the programmable interface?
if so, to how much? (I know there's caveats on the limits over blowing the controller, overheating etc but has anyone done this and lived to tell the tale of still having a workable controller?)
Cheers,
Magz
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Edited.
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So I just want to know the limit in Amps the external controller that comes with the MP will allow out of the box.
And, can the amp limit on the controller be amended up and down using the USB cable? if so, to what is the range it will allow the user to program it?
Thanks,
Magz
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Damn!
:-[
I am so sorry Magzy. I didnt get any sleep last night and I cross posted.. Frustration. :-[
Most report 20 amps cont and 25 amps max.
Yes the USB cable can limit the max and cont amps but not allow any more amps above the shunt or any bad connections.
The shunt should be 20 amps 25 amps max too.
Email GM and you wont get a real answer either if any answer at all. So these figures are just the general consensus here..
Sorry for the confusion.
Thank you.
Oh dear I just realized what I have done. I was interacting in one tab with some members and read your question in this tab and it didnt make sense.
Oh never mind please forgive me. :-\
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317537 you are right about the Ping copies and cheaper brands, but I do find Ping batteries very expensive for what they are. VPower do a cheaper one that is 15ah but I do not know how reputable they are?
I think you would be lucky getting 20 to 25 amps out of the GM controller, I could not coax more than 15 amps no matter what setting I did with the USB port. Had to bridge the shunt on mine, although I went over the top with over a hundred amps on take off.... but man did it take off he he.
I had a Cyclone 900W kit before this pie and used it with a 36V 15ah Ping battery that seemed to cope really well until I realised that I was using 30 to 40 amps on it average, no way the Ping could take that strain. The Magic Pie is so much more economical with the battery. Even with my over the top mod now on my Pie I still only use 0.5 amps a mile, and once it gets to 25mph the amps drop right down to 15amps again?
You will be happy with the Magic Pie wheel just get a good battery source for it. I still think the Ping will be ok for a while if you don't accelerate from stop using just the motor....peddal then motor and save up for another Ping.
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Leslie dude get some sleep! :D
I guess it is hard sleeping knowing your Pies are on the way..... would make you pretty hungry for them :) omm yomm yommm
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317537 you are right about the Ping copies and cheaper brands, but I do find Ping batteries very expensive for what they are. VPower do a cheaper one that is 15ah but I do not know how reputable they are?
I think you would be lucky getting 20 to 25 amps out of the GM controller, I could not coax more than 15 amps no matter what setting I did with the USB port. Had to bridge the shunt on mine, although I went over the top with over a hundred amps on take off.... but man did it take off he he.
100 amps. Wow the Pie certainly can suck up some power. Yeah I ordered tow MP's and Gary GM Canada tested my hubs and they get 25 amps out of the box.
I think there is some variations from one Pie to another. We may have found some poor solder connections in one controller and I suspect some of the stock GM mini motor controller are being shipped with the Pies. They may of got mixed up or the person putting the kit together isnt aware that maybe some of the controllers are limited to protect the mini motor.
ATM its all a bit confusing as to what is going on. Too many 15 amp on the mark controllers to suggest just errors in PCB soldering. 15 amps is the suggested max for the min imotor.
To much coincidence IMO.
The vpower is not too much different than the ping in performance. I think where Ping wins over Vpower is he is very good with support and warranty claims.
I was reading a post at V is for Voltage, where one chap's Ping pack caught fire and he had to call the fire department to put it out. Not a good thread for Ping. However the fire depo had to take his pack away and left him with a burnt looking bike, he was lost as to what to do.
A failed Ping pack and no pack to prove warranty! Well he took some pics of the damage and sent them onto Ping and Ping gave him a new one.
Well I hope my pack doesnt go up in smoke but Ping saved his reputation by replacing the pack under what some would call unusual circumstances.
I think this is sort of what you pay for with a Ping pack.
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Leslie dude get some sleep! :D
I guess it is hard sleeping knowing your Pies are on the way..... would make you pretty hungry for them :) omm yomm yommm
Yeah I need to cook the dinner for the family then I try watch some boring thing on TV and I will drop like a log.
While I am waiting for chicken to cook I just made my water proof controller switch for that 60 amp latching relay you linked me to. The new auto precharge main power relay for the MP is going to be sooo much better then my first attempt/.
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Hey mate
You just reminded me! My apologies, I don't think I replied to your post about triggering the relay.
I use a PIC to pulse the pin via a transistor. It's set at 100ms to compensate for temperature, works a charm. I went that way because I was using the PIC for switching other things. You could do the same thing with a momentary and cap just like you have previously posted, or a monostable trigger from a 555. Or you could do what I'm wiring up now so you don't have to worry about switches and keys ;)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250590394220&viewitem=
haha I'm still laughing while hooking this up
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317537 you are right about the Ping copies and cheaper brands, but I do find Ping batteries very expensive for what they are. VPower do a cheaper one that is 15ah but I do not know how reputable they are?
I think you would be lucky getting 20 to 25 amps out of the GM controller, I could not coax more than 15 amps no matter what setting I did with the USB port. Had to bridge the shunt on mine, although I went over the top with over a hundred amps on take off.... but man did it take off he he.
I had a Cyclone 900W kit before this pie and used it with a 36V 15ah Ping battery that seemed to cope really well until I realised that I was using 30 to 40 amps on it average, no way the Ping could take that strain. The Magic Pie is so much more economical with the battery. Even with my over the top mod now on my Pie I still only use 0.5 amps a mile, and once it gets to 25mph the amps drop right down to 15amps again?
You will be happy with the Magic Pie wheel just get a good battery source for it. I still think the Ping will be ok for a while if you don't accelerate from stop using just the motor....peddal then motor and save up for another Ping.
yes exactly as I was saying. Once up to speed the pie's current draw backs off to around 15-18 amps on level ground!
I would not buy from Vpower. My first kit came with a Vpower battery and It was supposed to be a 20amp battery after 14-15 amps it died. So it was not capable of 20 amps. I also took a hit on resale to Pat as I had to tell him it was only a 15 amp pack! Also it was larger and 5kg heaver than my ping! Also they were only good for 1C max! I don't know if VPower have improved, but from reading other forums, I think the general conclusion is to stay away from VPower!
At the end of the day we are not talking about some cheap 60 dollar controller here. If you buy the wrong battery you are stuck with it. And it will cost you a few hundred dollars. It's too big a price to pay to get it wrong. Ping makes good batteries and I can vouch for him, yes people have had problems with them, but he always replies to emails and he will always fix a problem!
Magzy I think you made a good choice with your ping. If you want you can set cruise at say, 14-15mph then peddle and you will greatly assist your motor and battery. If you want you can also use it full throttle as 15-20 amps will be your cruising power anyway if using internal or external controller. And won't be too stressful for the ping. Your 14kms trip will not be too much for it either!
Regarding your decision in either internal or external controller. If you order internal controller and you have problems with your controller, you will have to take your motor apart and solder in a new one. If you are capable of this then it's not so bad, just a pain. And it might take you an eternity getting a new one from GM.
If you think you might want more power then you are stuck, as the internal controller will not provide more than around 15-18 amps max.
IF you choose external controller, you will have more wires to try hide. But if things go bad with the controller, you can swap it easier. If you choose external magic controller from GM you will have a limit of 17-20 amps in general by my experiences and a few others. If you want more power you will need a controller from a different manufacturer and also a higher power ping, or buy another 10 amp, but you will need diodes connected to each battery. No big deal. If you go the external route, and you choose a GM magic controller, I would strongly advise buying 2 as they are cheap enough and you don't want to be off the road while you wait for another if one brakes.
I hope this is not too much information Magzy! ;D
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Yeah I need to cook the dinner for the family then I try watch some boring thing on TV and I will drop like a log.
While I am waiting for chicken to cook I just made my water proof controller switch for that 60 amp latching relay you linked me to. The new auto precharge main power relay for the MP is going to be sooo much better then my first attempt/.
Hey nice work BTW, I was wondering where you are going to mount the switch? Somewhere sneaky? Like under the seat and route the wires through the seat pole or something?
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Those lights are awesome and loud. I guess thats the point. LOL car will miss you then run into each other looking at this bedazzling bike zooming past them.
I would wonder about the legality of such attractive accessories. I think they serve the point of safety to the rider in a nut shell but the Boys in blue may see the hypnotic light spectrum spectacle differently.
I would really love to see your build and how its going. You really have done some great work so far and I mean this sincerely.
To give folks and idea what these Monkey Electric Lights are about. Take a look at this guys..
(http://i.ytimg.com/vi/j61mRq9Q4JE/0.jpg)
:o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o
Yeah under the seat so it can be switched off when I stand the bike and it wont look like I switch anything. I could do the remote thing or key switch but I lose keys and stuff too much.
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If you think you might want more power then you are stuck, as the internal controller will not provide more than around 15-18 amps max.
IF you choose external controller, you will have more wires to try hide. But if things go bad with the controller, you can swap it easier. If you choose external magic controller from GM you will have a limit of 17-20 amps in general by my experiences and a few others. If you want more power you will need a controller from a different manufacturer and also a higher power ping, or buy another 10 amp, but you will need diodes connected to each battery. No big deal. If you go the external route, and you choose a GM magic controller, I would strongly advise buying 2 as they are cheap enough and you don't want to be off the road while you wait for another if one brakes.
I hope this is not too much information Magzy! ;D
Not at all - this is perfect info - the more the merrier!
With regards to the controller I have two options
1. External: With regards to the wires and stuff I'm aiming to get a back rack with two courier type panniers. One to keep the battery in a foam mould to fit the bottom of the bag along with the controller. Another bag on the other side for stuff as a sort of counterweight. I'm cool-and-the-gang with shortening wires and re-soldering them - It's also stealthy - which I need ;) If I modit and blow it then no big deal in terms of replacing it.
2. Internal: I like the tidiness and stealthiness of the internal contoller but I know for a fact that I'm going to get addicted to speed and acceleration. I will want to mod this at some point in the future. Now I realise that amping up the controller to 100a will destroy it because of the heat and expansion and contraction on the circuit coupled with the risk of burning out components on the board. Just wondering if anyone has built an effective heatsink for the internal controller? maybe like a PC processor water cooling and an air duct intake with a propper radiator? In any case, can you buy the MP internal controllers separately from GM or even buy another manufacturers' controller and take out the board and fit it into the innards to the MP? (assuming you have a schematic of the board connections and are reasonably tech savvy)
I really like the GM Pie however. I really really like the fact that GM has this forum with great people who are willing to help n00bs like me out. This has not gone unappreciated folks.
One thing that bothers me is the fact that GM seem poor on getting issues resolved. I've trawled though this forum and found numerous instances where something has gone wrong (admittedly only a small fraction of end users) but it's taken up to 2 months to sort out with GM. This is unacceptable in my opinion and puts me off.
To put this into perspective, the number one rule of making money in retailing goods and services is retaining and then getting return custom easy if you do a good product like GM.
You're always going to have issues down the line but they need to have a policy of setting the expectation of the user for resolving these. pleasing existing customers because when they complain, they are complaining to the whole world on here and other places and the reputational damage can only be mended if the manufacturer exceeds the expectation of the user - as set out in the policy. The customer will then go out and sing the praises of the manufacturer and that will then draw in unlimited orders from new customers. The ping example of the battery exploding and being replaced is the perfect example of this where the manufacturer has far exceeded the expectations of the customer.
Can I be assured that GM will be of similar standing even if I need to buy a new internal controller?
Thanks,
Magz
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I think the internal controller should be fine with the 10ah pack its not like youre going be be drawing 35 amps out of it to make it too hot in there.
Its just a horror story to trouble shoot and or replace or if some thing goes wrong.
Another thing you may want to do is not use too much regen if any at all. As this pack is going to take a beating from the Pies regen.
Ping packs are not that great at charging as they are at discharging. Regn does worry the Ping.
1c charge rate is recommended.
I think maybe less than 1C for regen. Even though Regen isnt that constant and its the heat that is of concern and the cells may get hot when you riding them at 2C, then try charge at on 1C, Would be almost like charging 1.5C~1.75C~2C during heavy regen usage.
Know what I am saying here?
1C on a wall charger is only 1C constant, the cells can only reach a certain temperature. But your cells are not seeing any 2C action in that time its plugged into the wall.
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You really have done some great work so far and I mean this sincerely.
Hey thanks Leslie gee shawks ;)
Cheers well yes I am currently still in the process of some finishing touches on the bike... I didn't really want to start talking about it, but now that I think of it the accessories are getting a bit out of control haha
I'm nearly tempted to post whats going on with it now but I'd rather wait until I finished and take some pics along the way in case others are looking for ideas
Anywho won't be long now until pie time for you yeah?
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You should post what youre doing mate, as we learn more looking at the work in progress rather than looking at the finished product.
Pride has a habit of making us say no I don't want to show until its finished, if you have the time and patients I would like to spend some time with you with this.
Im up to stage two on my power distribution box.
Ive done the relay with 50 amp 250 volt cable and put Anderson poles on it.
Here.
(http://goldenmotor.com/SMF/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2428.0;attach=3170;image)
I guess this is what Im hooking up between my Ping pack and MP so its not off topic. Im thinking the box will sit either on top of Ping or in front of it under the seat.
The fuse and cables are rated at 50 amps. The relay is rated at 60 amps. the power poles are rated at 50 amps. The switch is DPDT centre off MOM.
That relay uses 1 watt of power to switch and takes the blink of an eye to switch it, It amazing. 1 watt in the blink of an eye to switch 50 amps. And no more watt needed to keep it there. It should be easy at that low current rating to put a bipolar electrolytic delay cap over the coil so I must hold the MOM switch down for .5 seconds before it activates the coil. The DPDT switch will have a resistor running off the on side straight to the controller so as I hold the switch down it allows current into the controller for precharge. With Precharge that relay should last 20 years and never have any issues. I could then use ultracaps for regen or something knowing that they aint going to kill the switch. :D
Yummy ultra caps can gets you more than 50 amps max if you wants, and save some hit on the Ping if they are diode blocked and shunted to stop ping from charging them too fast, then leave them open to regen and the controller. Great for that quick discharge take offs require.
Its a lil boxy though more stuff will be going in it.
The CA molded shunt will connect to the black cables and its rated at 45 amps. And I just hand wound an L100 inductor to go for the 3.2v 3 amps DC to DC converter for the cree clone lights. I have to build another switcher as my 12v one is only made to do 1 amp 12v.
Im not sure if I will put an alarm on the bike like you. But that would save a lock and key. Either way Im stuck with some device or key I could loose or drop. I lead a complicated life.
The ease of a bike alarm loud like yours is attractive, but I will need another DC to DC converter. How many amps does that alarm pull?
I found a 4 channel IR relay and key chain switching device. I fear if I go with something off the shelf the security isnt going to be too good especially if I boast it on the net,
Maybe I will do an RF design using modulated tones as the security, Make up an LF transmitter and receiver.. I never done radio before.
I may try my hand at voice activation, now this would suit me.. Hmmm. The alternatives are endless. but mind space I have is limited.
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Looking good leslie.
Was that black thing in your box the dc-dc converter or relay?
I want to get a box like that in black for my ping. It will be secure enough!
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Looking good leslie.
Was that black thing in your box the dc-dc converter or relay?
I want to get a box like that in black for my ping. It will be secure enough!
Its the 60 amp 240v polarized latching relay, The precharge polarized relay switch will be FAR superior to GM's connect and arc system, Ill prolly lose my warranty connecting the Pie up to something being NON GM parts and all ::).. So for now customrers will have to endure a year of connect and crack before you try this at home kids.
,Ill be making sure I don't have to unplug my pack just to turn the controller off and the controller has to be off before I can put charger to batts.
I couldn't believe GM leave no way to turn all power from the controller to batts.
This is the 60v DC to DC to 12v converters I built,
(http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c251/soulelectronique/Leddriver.jpg)
http://goldenmotor.com/SMF/index.php?topic=1566.0 (http://goldenmotor.com/SMF/index.php?topic=1566.0)
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Actually I have this circuit to mind that will switch the relay off If the bike has not been used for X time. It will work by making the circuit active when you switch the bike on and load off the throttle keeps the time threshold to max. When the rider say docent use the throttle for say 30 mins the controller will auto shut down.
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Yeah I like that idea Leslie, very clever indeed! ;D
I have noticed that my Anderson's connect and disconnect so much easier now from not sparking. Switches on a controller are a must. I know GM have switches on their batteries, I wonder how long they will last ?
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The ease of a bike alarm loud like yours is attractive, but I will need another DC to DC converter. How many amps does that alarm pull?
Hey mate, I have a 6.8Ah 12v lithium battery I run a heap of accessories off. I was going to convert the voltage but that can come at a loss, and the alarm standby would be less than 50mA, and the output alarm current would be MAX 500mAh
So the battery works well. You can also get this battery on eBay haha I've got heaps of stuff from there. Its tiny too I was amazed!!
http://cgi.ebay.com/DC-12V-6800mAh-Pile-Lithium-ion-Rechargeable-Neuf-/110567280754?pt=US_Batteries&hash=item19be52d072 (http://cgi.ebay.com/DC-12V-6800mAh-Pile-Lithium-ion-Rechargeable-Neuf-/110567280754?pt=US_Batteries&hash=item19be52d072)
Okay so I'll post the progress
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Leslie;
Let me know when you get the auto-cutout circuit.
I have been thinking of something like that, but I am stuck
at finding one that won't draw power when the switch is off.
That bistable latching relay may be critical.
Do you know where I can get one?
Elmer
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That bistable latching relay may be critical.
Do you know where I can get one?
Elmer,
I think Leslie got his relays on eBay:
(http://www.arhservices.co.uk/GoldenMotor/Latchingrelay60A.JPG)
Click for more details. (http://cgi.ebay.com/250672035433)
Alan
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Yes I'm using one of those, I built it into the switch compartment of the GM battery.
Basically I removed the 4 screws of the casing, and de-soldered the key switch and glued the relay in there with the negative connected through the relay.
I switch mine with a wireless key remote it's really convenient! The battery link I posted above is really small, I mounted mine under the battery rack and bolted it on there.
I originally bought 2 of them so I could make switchable series battery circuit for extra power.
They operate on a pulse signal. So 12v negative and positive to turn on, then reverse polarity to turn off. It needs to be pulsed momentarily otherwise it just keeps shorting and will eventually burn out.
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I tried the Relay out today on the HBS and Life Batt and shes a pearler.
To make an easy circuit I just did exactly this and it works very well.
(http://goldenmotor.com/SMF/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2428.0;attach=3232;image)
I used a momentary centre off, throw on DPDT toggle switch that reverses the polarity, You should use a 470 ohm 10 watt resistor in case something gets stuck and put the resistor before the DPDT toggle, so the toggle switch isn't not hooked directly to the battery at 52+v. The DPDT switch only sees 14v@ 84ma max over a second. Its quite an acceptable circuit in terms of reliability and safety for your gear.
My pack was charging at 58v and I was getting 14v over the coil. This is fine IMO. The relay is rated at 1 watt this can produces little more than 1.008 watts of there abouts.
Math for a 48v pack.
470 ohms + 150 ohms = 620 ohms.
I had 58v
So!
58/620 ohms = 0.09355 divider ratio.
V drop over 470 ohm resistor= 470 ohms X 0.09355 = 43.9685v
V drop over the relay = 150 ohm x 0.094 = 14.0325v
That is spot on to what I got on the multimeter rounded off to 5 decimal points.
48v pack at LVC
@ 41v pack/ 620 ohms = 0.06613= divider ratio.
V drop over 470 ohm resistor= 470 ohms X 0.066 = 31.02v
V drop over the relay = 150 ohm x 0.066 = 9.9v
I tested the relay with a 9v batt and it still switches with a nice click..
Cheers.