Author Topic: programming MP5  (Read 7282 times)

Offline Bentbike guy

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programming MP5
« on: August 05, 2019, 06:35:22 PM »
I purchased a MP5? several months ago (just hub motor) then added the required parts including the USB programming cable (5 pins).
running with a 36v battery and trying to change the software for 36v. Every time when I connect it reverts back to 48v.
When opening the throttle, the wheel starts to turn but then just stops.
the leds stay lit.
tried following the directions but notrthing seems to work.

Offline Tommycat

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Re: programming MP5
« Reply #1 on: August 05, 2019, 06:42:25 PM »
Are you clicking the save parameters to controller button after you change the voltage to 36?





See my completed Magic Pie V5 rear hub E-Bike build  HERE.

Offline Bentbike guy

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Re: programming MP5
« Reply #2 on: August 05, 2019, 09:59:45 PM »
will try again. 1st connect usb cable
2-pull up software  3- turn on battery power 4- load parameters  5- make desired voltage changes then save parms.
hopefully this will solve issues. It acts like a low battery. Wheel only turns for a few seconds then quits.
Have yet to charge battery due to the charger says it is charged. volt meter says 42 volts.

Offline Bentbike guy

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Re: programming MP5
« Reply #3 on: August 06, 2019, 03:35:25 PM »
found another forum tyhat explains it some what better. I had hopefully the wrong sequence.
CONNECT USB
OPEN SOFTWARE
SELECT COM PORT
CLICK CONNECT
CONNECT BATTERY

SAVE ALTERATIONS
UNPLUG USB
BATTERY OFF THEN ON

Offline Bentbike guy

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Re: programming MP5
« Reply #4 on: August 06, 2019, 06:54:24 PM »
Finally got it running. It was a programming issue.
curious, changing the voltage via programming do the other motor parameters change as well?
this is on a tadpole trike and thinking maybe using reverse?
need to slow it down as top speed it says 22mph.

Offline Tommycat

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Re: programming MP5
« Reply #5 on: August 06, 2019, 08:30:04 PM »
"Finally got it running. It was a programming issue."

Well done, glad to hear you established communication!


"curious, changing the voltage via programming do the other motor parameters change as well?"

Yes, I believe the high and low voltage limits go to a default as determined by the voltage set. But I think they can be tweaked (up to a point) if desired.


"this is on a tadpole trike and thinking maybe using reverse?"

Nice feature of the Pie! You can even set the max speed for it too. Would highly recommend a switch or position that could not be accidently changed easily... :o


"need to slow it down as top speed it says 22mph."

Had to do the same with the state regs here in Illinois...  Derated both the wattage and max RPMS. Nice to have more than you need. :) Runs nice and cool.
See my completed Magic Pie V5 rear hub E-Bike build  HERE.

Offline Bentbike guy

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Re: programming MP5
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2019, 12:00:41 AM »
Thanks Tommycat for steering me in the right direction.
I read that the MP5 is programmed for 48v  and the only affects the battery indicator. Well the MP5 running at anything less than 48v and no change in programming results in the motor not even working.

Offline Bentbike guy

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Re: programming MP5
« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2019, 06:25:48 PM »
now that I got it running some QUESTIONS
why does the hub motor roll when pushing it, so hard?
I see in the programming software, it has a parameter for gears?
the trike is a real slug from a standing start but top speed is 25mph. need to adjust.

Offline Tommycat

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Re: programming MP5
« Reply #8 on: August 07, 2019, 11:08:07 PM »
"Well the MP5 running at anything less than 48v and no change in programming results in the motor not even working."

With the voltage set at default of 48 volts nominal, the low voltage cut-out is defaulted to 42vdc.  So a 36 volt battery with a maximum charge of 42 volts just isn't going to make the cut.


"why does the hub motor roll when pushing it, so hard?"

Never really noticed a lot of drag when pushing. Perhaps a bit of magnetic resistance?


"I see in the programming software, it has a parameter for gears?"

Sorry, which one?




"the trike is a real slug from a standing start but top speed is 25mph. need to adjust."

Max acceleration, max battery draw for the controller?  Perhaps a boost in phase current, but having not needed this can't advise on the setting.
Typically more voltage is the cure for torque.  ;D



CORRECTION EDIT: As per Alan, the LVC default is indeed 42 volts at 48 volt nominal. Replaced erroneous screen shot. (was set at 45 volts for my 52 volt nominal battery...) :-[
« Last Edit: August 09, 2019, 12:57:10 PM by Tommycat »
See my completed Magic Pie V5 rear hub E-Bike build  HERE.

Offline Bentbike guy

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Re: programming MP5
« Reply #9 on: August 08, 2019, 03:18:48 PM »
I had a hunch that the voltage is the reason for it being a slug. Still need to maybe reprogram my top speed but we have no real police and I watch my speed anyway.
This build has a smother rear suspension, a lot softer on the bumps as I used heavy ball bearings instead of the standard rubber bushings. PLUS it turns on a dime and gives you 8 cents change. Very responsive. So responsive I think I could slide or wash out the rear tire if turning a a high speed (anything over 6mph?)

Offline Bikemad

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Re: programming MP5
« Reply #10 on: August 08, 2019, 09:09:00 PM »
With the voltage set at default of 48 volts nominal, the low voltage cut-out is defaulted to 45vdc.

The Undervoltage protection value (V) on my Magic Pie controllers all default to 42V:



Have you increased yours to 45V, or have GM changed the default values?

Typically more voltage is the cure for torque.

I am not so sure about that, as speed is proportional to the voltage, and torque is proportional to the current.

The following figures were taken from GM's Magic Pie dynomometer results for both 36V and 48V tests:

23.15Amps @ 36V = 27.2Nm of torque @ 202rpm
23.16Amps @ 48V = 27.4Nm of torque @ 280rpm

Although the torque and current are very similar for both voltages, producing this torque at a higher voltage (and higher rpm) produces more power.

I modified the internal controller on my original Magic Pie by increasing the thickness of the current sensing shunt, and this resulted in ~93Nm of torque @ zero rpm whilst drawing 65.94 Amps from a 25.9V 7S LiPo pack.
Check out this post for further details of how I measured and calculated the stall torque.

The modified controller produced even more torque when it was pulling 97.75 Amps from a 51.8V 14S LiPo pack:



Although the voltage sagged to ~45V under maximum load, it was still drawing a massive 4396.7 Watts of power from the battery pack.

At 97.75A, the torque was so strong that it would easily lift the front wheel when I tried to pull away from a standstill on level ground with full throttle (without pedalling), and I could not pull away uphill using full throttle continuously (again without pedalling) without the bike instantly flipping over backwards.  :o

Basically, if you want a higher top speed, you need a higher battery voltage, but if you only want more torque, you only need to increase the current going to the motor.  ;)

Unfortunately, it is not possible to easily modify the controllers on the MPIII, MP4 and MP5 like it was on the earlier MP and MPII internal controllers.  :(

I now have my Magic Pie controllers set to the maximum battery current (30A) for maximum power, and I also have the Phase current set to the maximum (70A) on MP4 and MP5 controllers where this setting is available.

If you really need more current than the factory controller can supply, you will have to swap to a high current external controller, and possibly a battery pack with a higher current output to suit.  ;)

Alan