Smart Pie problems

[Asybre]

Hello,
I recently bought a Smart Pie and am now having problems which I was hoping everyone in the forum could help with.
Being able to post on a topic would help a lot since the problems I encountered are not common.
Thank you!

SPECS:
14S5P Panasonic 18650PF cells w/ 25amp bms

EDIT:

So basically I bought a Smart Pie (I'm not even sure what version it is), I asked for an external controller, rear wheel and for the battery specs I wanted.
There was poor communication and basically I got the motor on a 20" wheel, I wanted 26", the usual internal controller had an extension to it and it wasn't even pre programmed to what I wanted, plus the motor was "kind of" adapted to the front wheel.

After I built the battery, I went on and tested the motor. With the wheel floating the motor worked fine but when I applied some weight on it the motor just stuttered and did not move at all.
I went on and investigated the connections and I found they had soldered all the connections to the controller instead of the connectors I saw online.

I undid all that work and soldered again everything (I probably should have got connectors) and as of now the motor works but not well.

Here is a photo of how the controller was and a video of the current state. I don't know as of now if the throttle, controller or the motor is broken but I hope you guys can help me.
https://youtu.be/ErLW45RTaMM

I have also contacted the vendor but I have to pay the shipping and it is just to much so I will tackle this myself.

Thank you very much. 

[Adamsavage79]

It could be the controller. The motor is really small for a 26 inch wheel, so that might be part of the problem. The other problem is that the controllers wires shouldn't be like that. They come with plugs and the controller is sealed in a silicone wrap or plastic. Not really sure what it is.

[Asybre]

It could be the controller. The motor is really small for a 27 inch wheel, so that might be part of the problem. The other problem is that the controllers wires shouldn't be like that. They come with plugs and the controller is sealed in a silicone wrap or plastic. Not really sure what it is.

It's a 26" but why would that be a problem? Too much load?
That's what I saw online, the circuits have silicone on them but still it's not waterproof as of now. I will troubleshoot the hall sensors as well as the throttle to see if that is ok.

[Bikemad]

That motor looks like an early Smart Pie 3 like the one I reviewed here.

As you say, it has been adapted to fit a front fork by machining off the threaded boss for the freewheel, and removing the cooling fan/disc mount. And presumably the axle has been reduced in length and the flat portions of the axle have been move in further by filing or machining them closer to the hub.

If you read my review linked above, you will see the following:

Also tested on 51.8V 14 cell 5Ah LiPo pack weighing 2.06 kg (4.54 lbs)
Maximum current: 31.72 Amps
Minimum Voltage:  51.98 Volts
Maximum Power:   1648.8 Watts
Maximum Speed:   25.3mph (measured with my phone's GPS)

The rpm of your wheel does not look like it would be anywhere near the 25mph that mine can do on a flat road.
Perhaps the throttle signal voltage is too low, or the Phase wire/Hall sensor wiring configuration is incorrect.
Check out this post regarding the throttle signal voltage.

Perhaps the rpm has been restricted in the controller settings?

Are you able to access the programmable setting in the controller, if so, which software are you using.
(Smart Pie 3 uses different software to Smart Pie 4 and 5.)

Although the Smart Pie is not very large motor, it should have more than enough power to pull away easily on the flat, but it will need some pedal assistance going up steep inclines, or the motor will struggle.

I have a front mounted Smart Pie 4 in a 27" wheel, and it will wheelspin very easily on loose ground when pulling away with full throttle, and I had to reduce the acceleration level to about 70% in the software to make it safer to use.

Alan
 

[Asybre]

Thank you very much for the help Alan.

Interesting enough I saw that review before buying, good job!

Regarding the adaptation, is it feasible to get a side cover with the threaded boss for the freewheel and to replace the axle to fit a rear wheel? Or is it just better to leave it like that?

I haven't figured out a way to test the throttle without cutting the wires tho.

Well that's new for me, I really thought it would be a SP 4 or 5, I was using the newest software along with CH340G cable and maybe that won't work...
Is the procedure to connect to the motor the same tho?

I was hoping to get +50km/h (+30mph) 

[Asybre]

Does anyone know the wiring from the motor to the controller? The name on the PCB is LBMCHYRcon1.3 2015-1-9

[Tommycat]

This looks like your controller...





But I don't know if it's wired for front or back use...as I think the rear spins CCW and the front CW looking at the controller side. But thinking on that I guess you could just flip the assembly so the controller is on the other side. I don't think he'd mind.

Hall sensors all check out? 

At this time are you using the reverse wire to get it to run in the direction you want?

Does the cruise function work?

What throttle do you have?

How do you know what the pre-programming is?


Regards,
T.C.

[Asybre]

I can just flip the assembly to the right position.

Haven't yet checked the hall sensors.

I'm not using the reverse.

I tried it the first time but it didn't do anything...

I went on and checked your build and great work there! I have the same throttle as you had, but I have to check it since I noticed the lights were heating up and I was just testing it freewheel.

I think I managed to change the settings but I'm starting to think maybe the controller is busted.

More uptades soon.

[Asybre]

Hall sensors are all ok. Throttle is showing correct voltages also but I bought a thump throttle anyway.

One thing I noticed while testing the hall sensor, I had the 3 phase wires disconnected and there was a red led blinking on the controller.

[Tommycat]

I went on and checked your build and great work there!

Thank you for your kind words.


 I have the same throttle as you had, but I have to check it since I noticed the lights were heating up and I was just testing it freewheel.

The throttles have a voltage rating stamped on them, 48 volts being the highest. But even at that , they will get warm with a full battery charge (58.8 volts for my 52 volt battery) as they're powered directly from battery voltage.
And they're accuracy is non-existent. As you may have read, a resistor in line with the LEDs will get em in range as well as have them run cooler!


I think I managed to change the settings but I'm starting to think maybe the controller is busted.

When you get it back together, I'd try disabling regen.

More uptades soon.

One thing I noticed while testing the hall sensor, I had the 3 phase wires disconnected and there was a red led blinking on the controller.

Count the number of the flashes, they correspond to a fault code.  As an example I believe 14 flashes indicates the throttle is disconnected.
(always wanted to know WHERE that light was! Thanks for the posted shot! 

And just a last comment if I may. As messed up as your order seems to be. It should be noted that altho the Smart Pie, the Edge, and Magic Pie all use the same controller...They all have different FIRMWARE. And this can be changed. But I don't know if it can be just checked. This is available for blue toothed enabled controllers...Not sure if yours is.  Possible last ditch effort....?

Regards,
T.C.

[Asybre]

The throttle is for 48V as I have read, it doesn't have any stamping but I checked the model.

I also tried using the old software for smartpie 3 but couldn't connect, using the newest I can. ( I'm having trouble understanding what upload and download mean in reference to the controller   )

I did count them, and it was 14 actually so yeah I forgot that!

My only problem would be buying the bluetooth adapter since it is quite expensive...

Thanks for the help!

[Tommycat]

The throttle is for 48V as I have read, it doesn't have any stamping but I checked the model.

Will get warm running at 60 volts...

I also tried using the old software for smartpie 3 but couldn't connect, using the newest I can. ( I'm having trouble understanding what upload and download mean in reference to the controller   )

Upload means that the software takes the settings out of the controller, and displays them on the screen.
Download means that the software takes the settings on the screen, and saves them to the controller.

I did count them, and it was 14 actually so yeah I forgot that!

My only problem would be buying the bluetooth adapter since it is quite expensive...

The blue tooth question was to verify that the controller you have CAN be firmware flashed... as this applies to the newer Bluetooth enabled controllers.
Firmware flash can be done with the USB cable...  I have never done this.

Thanks for the help!

Your welcome! Any positive progress?

Regards,
T.C.

[Bikemad]

I also tried using the old software for smartpie 3 but couldn't connect, using the newest I can.

That's good, if it connects with the later software then it must be a vector controller, so it's definitely a Smart Pie 4 or 5 and not a Smart Pie 3.

Alan

[Asybre]

That clears things up, the software can be confusing on those matters.

I will have to check if it can be flashed then.

I have no idea how to approach the problem of having the connections soldered, it shouldn't be a problem but if connected as of the picture T.C. showed it's not working, then there's something wrong with the controller or the wiring..

Thanks Alan!

[Tommycat]

Have you checked your solder joints to make sure the pins are still making good connections to the board? (hall sensors)
Cruise doesn't work in reverse. Just double check that all the unterminated wires are separated and not touching any thing. Especially the ones at the controller harness...


Make sure to try it with regen disabled in the controller... I've seen where too high of voltage may mess things up here.  And try it with your battery voltage reduced...