MP5 problem.... did it die?

[StadsImker]

Today I wanted to ride my bike (MP5)

I did move for just a second and than it didn't respond any more..... I Tried for 30 minutes. Than it moved again for a second... but than t was dead again.

I tried to read out my MP5 using the USB-programing cable. My pc sees the usb programing cable on Com6.... But no connection is made...

Then I tried to connect through Bluetooth but no bluelight and no GM (bluetooth device) on my phone...


Anybody any ideas what I can try?   

Thanks,
Philip - From the Netherlands

[Wklatt]

What is the status of your battery, voltage, etc?

[StadsImker]

Hello,

My batterypack is fully charged.   A round 28 volt...  Like normal...

I don't think that's the problem. I checked with multi-meter the connection to the MP5 motor and everything looks okey.

Thanks for your relpy!
Philip

[Bikemad]

Hi Philip.

Are the three LEDs on the throttle unit all lighting up correctly, and has the motor been working OK with your 24V battery pack before today?

Check that all of the connectors are properly pushed together, but if that doesn't make any difference, try unplugging the two brake switch connectors to see if it is a switch or brake wiring problem that may be preventing it from running.

Regarding the programming connection problem, you will need to make sure that your reverse switch is in the OFF position so that the controller will be able to connect correctly using the USB lead.

Have you previously been able to connect via Bluetooth or USB?

Alan
 

[StadsImker]

Hi Alan,

These LEDs on the throttle never lightup, but the bike functioned perfect for many months. My bike is a daily driver and drives about 30 km a day. I will check all electrical connections today, but I don't think there is a problem. Because my bike was always function perfectly and nothing changed in the last days.

Before I programmed my MP5 with USB programming cable and also the bluetooth connection was functional. If I connect the power to the wheel should there be a blue light visible on the bluetooth dongle?

And an other question.... The manual says something about beeps when there is a problem. But will the wheel beep? Or will the horn beep ( I didn't buy the horn) and I tried the reset function but never heard a thing. Push 5 times the cruise control button with brake switch on.

I also tried disconneting the brake(s). I never used both brakes and it always functioned okey with only a single brake handle. Disconnecting the brake handle didn't result in a working MP5.

Yesterday when I noticed the problem. The MP5 worked for just a short second. Like you push very shortly on the gashandle, but than nothing. After a 20/30 minutes trying to reset, reconnect and checking. I did ones the same. Just for a short moment the MP5 generated some force, but it stopped quickly...

I will check all connections and disconnect and reconnect all connections and check the reverse wiring. But I don't think there is a problem.

Hope it is notthing big because I need my transport bike to take care of all my beehives all over the city. I have more than 40.... and winter is comming for my bees. Problems always come at the worst time...

Thanks for think with me!

Greetings, Philip

[Bikemad]

Hi Philip,

If the LEDs on the throttle have never lit up it sounds like you might have a 48V throttle unit which requires at least 30V just to light the first Red LED, but a 48V throttle would only affect the operation of battery gauge LEDs and not the throttle operation. Check that the throttle connector is still nice and dry inside, as water in the connector can cause problems.

I have just checked on my Magic Pie, and the blue LED on the Bluetooth dongle flashes once when the battery is first connected, and only lights up continually when my phone is actually connected to it via Bluetooth.

As the motor doesn't run and the bluetooth doesn't work, I would say it is either a fault in the battery supply cable and full battery voltage is not getting to the controller, or the controller itself may have failed. 

You should be able to confirm that full battery voltage is reaching the controller by measuring the voltage between the Red lighting feed wire and Black or Blue ground wires with the switch on the throttle pressed in (if they are easily accessible).



I would also recommend that you check that there is at least 4V between the Red +5V feed and Black ground wire going to the Pedelec sensor connector.
If you don't have a pedelec sensor connector fitted, make sure that the unused wires are not exposed and touching each other, as this could also prevent the motor from running.

However, if your Bluetooth was still working, a faulty Hall sensor (in either the throttle unit or the motor) could also prevent the motor from running. 

The MP5 controller does not beep like some of the earlier MPII controllers when a faults occur, but certain faults are displayed in the centre of the speedometer on the Bluetooth display (and error codes are also indicated on the BAC-601 LCD display unit if fitted).
On the inside of the MP5 controller there is an LED indicator on the circuit board that will flash a different number of times to indicate different faults, but the controller needs to be removed to see this. 

The reset function (holding the brake and pressing the cruise button five times) only applies to some very early external GM controllers.

If you can't find an external problem with the wiring etc. then I suggest you contact your supplier and explain the problem and ask their permission to remove the controller so as not to invalidate the warranty.

At least you can rule out the brake switch and its wiring. 

Alan
 

[StadsImker]

Hello Alan,

Thanks for your help so far. I am a step further. I get an electric connection, even a bluetooth connection with the MP5.

But as soon as I give some power with the trotthle everything dies. And also my smartfone is disconnected form the bluetooth connection with the MP5. And worse the motor is not responsive any more. Only a electric disconnection and reconnection resets the wheel.  (Anderson Powerpole 30A)

What can be the problem?

Hope you have an answer,
Philip.

[Bikemad]

Hi Philip,

When the Bluetooth disconnects, do you still have full battery voltage at the controller?

Are you using a BMS or fuse with your Headway cells?

A poor connection in a fuse holder can result in severe arcing under load, which produces a lot of heat and the burnt contacts will often prevent normal current from flowing:



As the problem only occurs when you activate the throttle, it might be due to a poor (weak) +5V supply from the controller that cannot cope with the additional load, or perhaps a short circuit to ground somewhere on the throttle signal wire which is overloading the +5V supply.

If you can measure the voltage on the +5V supply as the throttle is first operated, you should be able to see if it drops completely or  remains at the correct ~4V. 

Check the motor cable where it exits the motor to make sure it isn't touching against the inside of the cooling fan/disc mount:

Accessing the controller should be relatively easy once the wheel has been removed from the bike.

If you watch Gary's video you will see exactly how it's done.

The circlip that secures the cable against the axle can sometimes be a bit awkward to remove where it fits into the tiny holes in the axle. All you need to do is use a pair of pointed tweezers or a small thin flat blade screwdriver to gently ease out each end of the clip in turn:



Here is a picture showing the clip holding the cable nice and snug into the axle's recess, to keep it well away from the centre of the rotating cooling fan/disc mount assembly to prevent damage from chaffing:

If the cable retaining clip has accidentally been dislodged during the original wheel fitting procedure, the cable will rub against the centre of the cooling fan until the insulation wears right through to the copper wires inside, creating a short circuit.

If the steel circlip is missing completely, you can use a suitable zip tie instead:



Alan
 

[Wklatt]

The fuse possibility description reminded me of a problem I one had with an aircraft radio. When I hit transmit, sometimes the radio would die and reboot and then come alive again,... very annoying when trying to talk to a controller. I eventually traced it back to a panel switch that loosened up internally, and the poles were not making solid contact. The clue was that it only happened during transmit which demands higher power for the radio. An aircraft panel is a high vibration environment, and over time the switch became defective. I replaced it with a high quality one, and problem solved.

In this case, the power seems to be lost when throttle (which demands more power) is applied, so perhaps also there might be a poor connection somewhere, whether it is a fuse, BMS, battery connections, or poor ground.

Just a thought...

[StadsImker]

Hello,

I found the problem! It was a "bad" connection. It had okey contact for low amps, but when more amps where asked, It didn't had a good connection due to resistant. I think some carbon build up due to sparks inside the bad connection. With a multi meter this isn't easy to find. But replacing the connection the problem was gone.

So my advice is solder connections or use good connection-plugs like for example Anderson Powerpole 35A. And not to use cheap plastic or nylon terminal blocks with a small screw.

Greetings,
Philip