Author Topic: VEC 200 3KW 48V Starting Issue  (Read 7251 times)

Offline Arno

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VEC 200 3KW 48V Starting Issue
« on: February 15, 2022, 09:00:41 PM »
On my Simson Scooter Conversion

https://simson-kr51-tinita.tumblr.com/

Batterie LiFePo 100 AH 16S
Controller VEC 200
Motor Golden Motor 3kW

I did my first test ride last weekend after some years of weekend tinkering.

Now I have a starting problem: the bike doesn’t start from the stand if pushed only very slightly it accelerates quite smoothly. And that happens only in forward mode going back the bike accelerates from the stand.
Now I found the programming cable at the bottom of a box and wonder which software to use? I downloaded the VEC300 software.
And if that works which parameter could be changed for that problem?

Many thanks in advance

Arno
 

Offline Bikemad

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Re: VEC 200 3KW 48V Starting Issue
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2022, 09:39:14 PM »
Hi Arno andto the forum.

I'm not sure why the starting torque is lower in the forward direction than it is in reverse, but it might help to increase the Acceleration (rpm/s) setting to 600 (or higher if it will accept it).

If the Forword speed ratio (%) setting is currently less than 100, set it to the maximum (presumably 100%).

If that doesn't help, upload some screenshots of the existing parameter settings so we can see if anything else that may be incorrectly set.

The only setting I can see that would produce different torque in forwards and reverse is the Reverse torque ratio (%) setting, but that shouldn't reduce the forward torque, only reverse.  :-\
That should not affect your motor unless you have it permanently switched in "Reverse" to change the motor's direction of rotation.

Alan
 

Offline Arno

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Re: VEC 200 3KW 48V Starting Issue
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2022, 08:41:42 PM »
Thanks a lot for the quick answer Alan. I'll try to fix that next weekend (if it's not raining cats and dogs) .

Here's a video of the testride:

https://youtu.be/nFrK1frDO1U

Starting issue about 0:33s

Arno


Offline Arno

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Re: VEC 200 3KW 48V Starting Issue
« Reply #3 on: February 19, 2022, 08:36:40 PM »
-Today I tried to set the controller ... but somehow the program and technology did not understand each other. When connecting to the PC, the controller flashes but the program does not find it. And what the additional ground connection on the cable should not understand me. Everything tried moped to moped and me additional ground connection to the (12V) ground. Always the same result no connection. The USB port is apparently recognized, it changes when changing from port 5 to port 6.

Pictures: https://simson-kr51-tinita.tumblr.com/post/676645624406523904/heute-habe-ich-versucht-den-controller

Offline Arno

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Re: VEC 200 3KW 48V Starting Issue
« Reply #4 on: May 15, 2022, 10:31:28 AM »
At last I had the time to connect my contoller and play a bit with the options ...  but I dindn't solve my problem  still only starting wit a (mnimal) initiall push forewards ... and no problem Backwards.

Screenshots of the last configuration attached.

Offline Bikemad

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Re: VEC 200 3KW 48V Starting Issue
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2022, 01:31:53 PM »
Hi Arno,

Are you sure your changed parameters have actually been saved to the controller?
The icons can be a bit misleading:



The configurations shown in your last post appear to have the Throttle mode selection set to 0:Hyperbola ("Reverse - Neutral - Forward" boat type throttle) instead of 1:Linear (zero to maximum rpm).

If the controller has not saved the shown Throttle type correctly, I'm concerned that it may not have saved the Forword speed ratio (%) to the 100% setting shown.

If the settings have definitely been saved, which can be confirmed by reloading (Uploading) the settings, perhaps the power to the controller needs to be cycled before any changes in the settings can take effect?  :-\

My only other thought is that the 3-Gears enable function may select the Default gear setting when the function is disabled.  :-\
I would set the Default gear(0:HG 1:MG 2:LG) setting to 0 (High Gear) for maximum speed/power.

If the 3-Gears setting only affect the forward speed, and the default gear (currently set to Medium) is automatically selected when the 3-Gears enable parameter is set to 0:Disable, this might result in reduced power pulling away in the forwards direction, but not in reverse.

If you are using a typical Hall Type throttle, I recommend that you set the Throttle voltage range protection enable setting to 1:Enable and then reset the throttle voltages to the default values shown below:



Failure to utilise the throttle voltage protection with the correct settings could result in the motor being stuck at full throttle if the Ground wire going to the throttle had a poor connection, or somehow broke or became completely disconnected.

Alan
 

Offline Arno

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Re: VEC 200 3KW 48V Starting Issue
« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2022, 07:42:27 PM »
Hi Alan
thank you for your advice.
I found your explanation list in the forum (see picture) and used it while changing the parameters (connect – change parameters – download – upload to control – test ride – reconnect to control). So, if I’m going to change step by step next weekend my plan is to check every change separately:
1.   set throttle to linear
2.   I’m using a Magura throttle I think it’s hall type so enable throttle range protection with your values
3.   Set 3 gear setting to 0
    Another Question: The starting Phase current is set to 20.0 A is that ok?

Thanks in advance

Arno

Offline Bikemad

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Re: VEC 200 3KW 48V Starting Issue
« Reply #7 on: May 17, 2022, 03:50:20 PM »
Hi Arno,

I have never used a VEC200 controller myself, so I don't know if increasing the Starting phase current (A) will improve the initial take off torque as I would not expect it to reduce the maximum available torque.

I think the default value for the starting phase current is 15 Amps, but you should be able to safely experiment with different values to see if it makes any noticeable difference.

It might also be worth increasing the stall protection time (s) and the Maximum phase current duration (s) to allow more time to accelerate away from a standstill under load.

Do You have any way of measuring the current being drawn when you try to pull away?
It would be interesting to see if there is a big difference between the Forward and Reverse maximum current draw under load while the scooter is stationary.

Let's hope that you can find a simple fix for the problem (or can at least improve it) when you alter settings at the weekend.



Alan
 

Offline Arno

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Re: VEC 200 3KW 48V Starting Issue
« Reply #8 on: May 19, 2022, 04:37:14 AM »
Hi Alan

I tried to film my battery monitor (set on Amps) while startig. Backwards the amps go up without noise fowards you hear a motor blocking noise with the falling to zero amps. I hit the break when motor noise appears.

Arno

https://www.facebook.com/arno.deuker/videos/1056845678243147 

or

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1MBFbnagpJ4lhhEsibns5QGtrt3WZ3-dN/view?usp=sharing

Offline Arno

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Re: VEC 200 3KW 48V Starting Issue
« Reply #9 on: May 22, 2022, 08:28:41 AM »
Hi Alan

I tried some changes out yesterday:

Setting throttle to linear ? not solved, harder acceleration
enable throttle voltage range protection   ? not solved, blocking with full throttle
all possible combinations ? not solved
Starting phase current 20,30, 40A ? not solved
stall protection time (s) 2, 3, 4 s ? not solved
maximum phase current duration (s) ? as the blocking is quite immediate not touched

so I have no Idea what could be different forward to backward.

Greetings Arno