Author Topic: Water in the controller  (Read 12556 times)

Offline twinboat

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Water in the controller
« on: February 11, 2012, 10:44:28 PM »
   I have 2 magic controllers, on 2 bikes, that got wet in a rain storm.  2 days latter I plugged in the battery's and they didn't work. I opened the controller box's and found them half full of water. I drilled drainage hole in them and flipped the controllers over to let them dry.  Do you think they will dry out and work again or do I need to replace them

Offline Leslie

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Re: Water in the controller
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2012, 03:53:46 AM »
If possible shake any excess water from controllers, Open the cases enough to allow good airflow into them and leave them in the sun for a day or so, I hope it works.  Hair dryer may be handy.

A word of advice which may not apply to yourself but I will put the message out here just the same.  Totally sealing you motor battery case and or controller will eventuate in gathering of moisture inside your controllers. All boxes and housing must be allowed to breath.

I have made this mistake on one of my hubs and an old controller that failed. And every time I try to seal my ebike gear from water they get codensation occuring inside them. 

I thought it was water getting in from the rain too and have made this mistake more than once too.

Bring it on

Offline Leslie

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Re: Water in the controller
« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2012, 04:40:17 AM »
My first brushed motor ebike controller installation.

With the contoller brushed conroller that I lost due to water.  I sealed it totally with silicone.  Not to my knowledge with in weeks it was full of moisture.

I had created a very dangerous situation where the controller would occasionally stick in full speed or the power would drop right our.  I opened the controller and to my suprize there was significant amounts of water inside. I emptied it, and dried it in the sun, and thought, I better seal this better this time.. 

So I sealed it with more silicon.  The same thing happened, but I had total failure..  Controller full of water but this time it had not rained at all.  I though OMG how did this happen.  Anyway the controller gave up the ghost and I ordered a new one and remainded none the wiser from this experience.

My first GM ebike hub.

I bought my GM hub, and when it arrived, I thought, waters going to get inside this as it isnt water tight.

I sealed the hub axel and rubbed silicon into the housing wall seats. I thought it was perfect air tight.


If you seal the axel where the wires go into the motor. Same goes with contollers.  Your equipment must be able to breath but not though the  GM isntalled seals  As the motor cools if you leave it in the rain, water sitting rests around the hub or contoller housing seats gets sucken into the motor/controller. 

Also after the rain humidty is high, after a ride the hot motor/contoller cools and air contraction causes humdity to slowy be sucked into the hub/contoller as it cools.  At night the water condenses and moister and air create iron oxide to form on the steel stator and a lot the mositure is abosbed..  This cycle continues and water can present inside sealed boxes that get hot and cold, can occur over days depending on how much humidity is in the air and what circumstance occur. 

I would estimate after a heavy rain and high humidty and regular riding, I had over a table spoon of water in my hub swishing around until a hall sensor failed maybe a week after the humidty and rains...  I found reference to sealing ebike equipment on this and other forums, that indeed this is a fact.

Since then I leave the the gear alone and only sheild my gear from getting wet, and have ridden gauntlet runs for much needed supplies through the worst flood rains in australian history and my "GM" equipment has remained bone dry to this day.  A good water resitant design is better than water proofing.

I not sure any of this applies to yourself, but needless to say my shared experiences over the years may be important for this topic.

Bring it on

Offline fx-82au

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Re: Water in the controller
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2012, 11:19:04 PM »
Hi guys, sorry to dredge up this old thread but it fits my problem pretty well.
My MP3 was out in the rain the other day and got pretty wet. I didn't ride it for a few days after that as I wanted it to dry out properly first. Today when I went to ride it I was welcomed with an extremely jerky and noisy motor that couldn't provide and forward thrust. This triggered alarm bells in my head for a failed hall sensor, but when I turned the motor on I did not get the two beeps from the controller.
Does this sound to you like I have water shorting out a hall sensor in the bottom of the hub? Has anyone got any ideas on how to best dry it out properly?

Offline Bikemad

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Re: Water in the controller
« Reply #4 on: November 12, 2012, 12:03:02 AM »
This triggered alarm bells in my head for a failed hall sensor, but when I turned the motor on I did not get the two beeps from the controller.

Hi Julian,

Your problem could be caused by water either affecting the hall sensors, or the controller itself, but either way, you will not receive any beeps from the controller (even if the hall sensors had completely failed) because the MPIII does not have a beeper unit fitted to the controller like the earlier MPI & II internal controllers had.

If the problem is moisture related, you may need to remove the controller and place the wheel in a warm dry place and allow it to dry out completely before you reassemble it and try to use it again.

If the motor is under warranty, you must first contact your supplier and ask their permission to remove the controller before you start to dismantle anything.

Alan
 

Offline fx-82au

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Re: Water in the controller
« Reply #5 on: November 12, 2012, 04:13:47 AM »
Thanks for the reply Alan.
I just did some testing and am sure positive it is a Hall Sensor failure. I just hope that it is because of water and can be fixed.
I purchased from goldenmotor.com (China). I understand there is someone who deals with issues like this, but do not know who to email. Can anybody provide an address?
Thanks

Offline Cornelius

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Re: Water in the controller
« Reply #6 on: November 12, 2012, 06:37:08 AM »
You should also consider that water has penetrated the battery, making the bms damp... That would lead to intermittent power and power cutouts... :)

Offline fx-82au

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Re: Water in the controller
« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2012, 06:51:18 AM »
I am positive that there is no water in the battery because it was inside charging when the rain fell and has stayed there since, except when I tried to ride my bike.

This afternoon I confirmed in my mind that it was a hall sensor failure. The bike was very jerky as if the motor did not know where the wheel was and when to push, but when I pedaled up to speed and used the throttle it was able to sync nicely and ride with only a little bumpiness from the motor. Regen braking worked fine at this time.

But then...
Just as I finished my ride, I felt the power cut out and it felt as though the regen braking had been applied. The motor would not respond, and my LEDs would not light up. My motor is now permenantly braking, with the battery connected and disconnected, the LED throttle indicator will not light up, and I cannot use my bike. I have tried to connect to a PC and that worked, the software detected the controller and was able to change settings, but I do not interpret that as saying all is well with the controller.

I think I am experiencing the same problem as Mikko in this http://goldenmotor.com/SMF/index.php?topic=4633.15 which has been attributed to a failed motor controller. I have tried disconnecting all the connections and ensuring they are dry but this has not fixed the problem. Unfortunately I am going on holiday for three weeks so cannot work on it, but I guess it may take that long to hear back from gm china anyway...
Wish me luck

Offline Bikemad

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Re: Water in the controller
« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2012, 02:29:15 PM »
It sounds as if the controller has comletely failed and is shorted out, which is why the motor is difficult to turn.  The LEDs will not light up because the shorted controller will also prevent battery voltage from reaching the gauge.
Hopefully the battery's BMS will have prevented the short circuit from damaging the battery.



Now go and enjoy your holiday and then you can let us know what happens with the controller when you return.

Alan
« Last Edit: July 02, 2017, 07:56:44 PM by Bikemad »

Offline MAGICPIE3FOCUSPOWER

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Re: Water in the controller
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2012, 06:34:36 PM »
I had the same problem with the earlier Pie.
Why don't GM spray the controller with waterproof stuff?

Offline skylinenitro

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Re: Water in the controller
« Reply #10 on: December 09, 2012, 09:03:34 PM »
When I modded my external mp2, I painted most everything on the PCB with liquid electrical tape before I fit it all together.  I left a little room to allow air in by the power and phasewire connectors for pressure changes so that the controller can breathe if it really needs to.  But I don't try to help it breathe.

You have to take in account that when it storms, the air pressure is lower out then when it is sunny (most of the time).  And when you ride your bike with the motor on, heat builds up inside the controller, creating a higher pressure in the controller that needs to be released.  When you finish riding, your controller cools and much like an air conditioner, will condensate any moisture in the air.

The only way to properly keep moisture out of stuff, is to suck ALL of the air out and then seal it inside a vacuum (like the vacuum of outer space).

I wonder if those silica gel packs that we are told to not eat can help wick moisture out of the controller/batts
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Offline MAGICPIE3FOCUSPOWER

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Re: Water in the controller
« Reply #11 on: December 09, 2012, 10:00:50 PM »
Or Plastic Dip is also fine :)