GoldenMotor.com Forum
General Category => Magic Pie & Smart Pie Discussions => Topic started by: GoldenMotor on March 16, 2010, 01:58:21 AM
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Hello All,
In the making of the Version II, I've somehow managed to convince Philip to increase the Volt limit of the Magic Pie to 90V (happy?). We will be testing to see if it's stable enough for the spokes/rims etc. Once that's finished, then it would be put on the website for sale.
Magic Pie II
Changelog:
1)Max volts accepted increased to 90V (accepts 24V, 36V, 48V and 72V)
2)Controllers are upgraded to programmable controllers of which the controller's parameter settings can be edited using a PC with optional interface cable with USB port.
3)Major spoke pattern upgrade to increase reliability of the spokes (Re: BikeMad spoke diagram)
4)USB-MagicPie II Cable is optional for those want programming features.
5)motor ring and axle upgrade to relocate the center of the hub, aligning it to the center of the bike frame.
6)16", 18" cast MagicPie, and 24", 26", 700c and 28" spokes MagicPie wheel will be available to adapt most exsting bicycles
I've somehow also managed to convince Philip to do another round of promotion. As well as an approximated 190USD offer to those that have bought the first Magic Pie. (I'm not sure about the cost price of this new Magic Pie)
This section of the forum is dedicated to this product and useful complaints/discussions of this product will be taken into consideration.
Thanks to all the members of this forum.
Yours,
Yao Yuan
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Hello Yao!
Nice and very good! That is exactally why I chose to be a dealer for Golden Motor in Brazil (I'm Bruno F. Porto, the one who is negotiating with .....) You hear your costumers and this is very, very good! ;D
I should close the deal this week, but I was planning to buy 10 Magic Pies and I'm concerned with the actual known problems, mostly the off center rim with is the only serius problen I had so far. When do you think that the MPII will be available?
You could call it Magic Pi (? greek) with is a very nice name.
I would like to give you an idea for the battery meter - PUT IT IN THE BATTERY as they do with notebooks batteries, that type that shows you the battery level when you press a push button, there is no need for that big and not so precise battery metter inside the throttle. This should be really nice.
*Edited
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Yao,
It's good to know changes are being made, how soon do you think before they will be available?
1)Max volts accepted increased to 90V (accepts 24V, 36V, 48V and 72V)
I'm not so sure the throttle mounted battery gauge will be able to cope with 90V, as my 36V unit already gets very warm on 56V.
Don't forget 60V for those still using SLA batteries.
5)motor ring and axle upgrade to relocate the center of the hub, aligning it to the center of the bike frame.
I thought the rim was being realigned to the center of the bike frame.
6)16", 18" cast MagicPie, and 24", 26", 700c and 28" spokes MagicPie wheel will be available to adapt most existing bicycles
No mention of a 20" wheel option?
Any chance of Variable Regen being implemented on the version II?
Is the Reverse option going to be made available on Version II?
What's the latest on the anti-theft and alarm function?
Can the LVC be lowered to 18V so that 22.2V 6cell LiPo packs can be used?
Alan
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I can only answer one question at the moment, Volt range of MPII is 0 to 90V
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Hello,
I just started researching in converting a bike to Electric and found the Magic Pie. I see you offer it in a 28" version. Is that to convert a 29er mountainbike? I am trying to decide between 700c & 29er. When will the new version II be available? Rough guess is fine? I am not in any hurry and would be willing to wait since I am a heavier rider at 240lbs and may be able to use the added voltage ability.
Take care,
Marc
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Q: No mention of a 20" wheel option?
A: In the process of making. All the 20" will be Magic Pie II.
Q: Any chance of Variable Regen being implemented on the version II?
A: If you are talking about changing the level of Regeneration, then it would be available by just using the software provided by us. If you are talking about something else then I'm not sure what you are talking about.
Q: Is the Reverse option going to be made available on Version II?
A: Reverse Option is too dangerous to be considered for implementation, however, such a function exists in the controller.
Q: What's the latest on the anti-theft and alarm function?
A: ... Brainstorming...
Q: Can the LVC be lowered to 18V so that 22.2V 6cell LiPo packs can be used?
A: Magic Pie II's lowest voltage limit is now 18V.
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Q: Any chance of Variable Regen being implemented on the version II?
A: If you are talking about changing the level of Regeneration, then it would be available by just using the software provided by us. If you are talking about something else then I'm not sure what you are talking about.
Variable regenerative breaking means: be able to control the level of the regenerative WHILE you are breaking. An example:
When you just breaks, the regenerative will works at a standart (or set by usb) level, but if you use the throttle togueter you can set it up to brake softly, in such way that you can keep a high speed, controlled speed, down hill while the regen recharges the battery OR you can set up a low level in such way that you can pedal the bike and recharge the battery a little.
It would be nice if the CC do this automatically - let me explain the idea - For example, now my pie set the CC level by the throttle, not the speed. But if the controller is intelligent enough it will control the speed! Acelerating uphill to keep it and using VARIABLE REGENERATIVE BRAKE downhill to keep the same speed even in a very step down hill. This will be VERY SMART.
And if in the case I use the bracke+thottle to set up certain level of regen and press the CC button, the bike will keep that regen level (no aceleration, juts a small breaking effect) in such way that peddalling will give the battery some juice, want some example??? Here it is!
http://www.epluselectricbike.com/TidalForce_M750_x2pt0_Electric_Bike_Features.php
Check this from that link:
1.* Through the E+ Advanced LCD display unit, the E+ can be set into one of nine different "fitness" modes which turns the motor into a generator and charges the battery as you pedal. Basically, the higher the resistance the more you charge the battery - become your own human electricity generator!
2.* Each time either brake lever is pressed, the motor is used to help slow the vehicle down through regenerative braking. The energy created by the motor spinning is used to charge the battery as the vehicle slows down.
So, this is what VARIABLE REGEN means and can do, besides the smart CC, smart downhill max speed control, etc - this would be new and never seen in the market!!
I'm sure that the Golden Motor would be much more smart - the LCD could be a bluetooth wireless one, so it will show speed, set up the regen level, or the "fitness level", show battery voltage, Ah consumption, etc. Why I would need to plug my bike to a pc with such a device? ;) Or even wired to be cheaper and it can be sold separeted, and use the same wires that the usb connection will use - I can chose to have an nice "ebike computer" or to set up this things using the cheaper usb cable.
Just some ideas!!!
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To summarize the possibilites of the Smart Regen (a trademark of Golden Motor!!!? 8) )
1- Set up a maximum downhill speed
example: If you set up 45km/h when you are at a very inclined dowhhill the regen will automatically works to keep that maximum speed and of course recharges the battery
2- Smart CC
example: When you press the CC button it will be based on the SPEED not the throttle position, so when you press the CC at 30 km/h the pie will automatically acelerate increase power uphill and use the smart regen to keep it at 30km/h downhill
3- Charge the battery while peddaling, or "Fitness mode"
example: You use the cc button+throttle or set it up by the ebike computer to apply a very low level of regen so you will pedal your bike and recharges the battery, and grow some muscles :D In this case, when you use the brake again it will activate the standard regenerative brake level and then goes back to the set "fitness level" and to turn this completely off you can accelerate using the throttle or press just the cc button again.
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It would be nice if the CC do this automatically - let me explain the idea - For example, now my pie set the CC level by the throttle, not the speed. But if the controller is intelligent enough it will control the speed! Acelerating uphill to keep it and using VARIABLE REGENERATIVE BRAKE downhill to keep the same speed even in a very step down hill. This will be VERY SMART.
Bruno, have you been reading my posts again? ::)
Variable regen suggestion (http://goldenmotor.com/SMF/index.php?topic=1220.msg6159#msg6159)
Alan
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LOL! ;D
Someone told me some time ago that great minds think alike!
8)
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You said there would be a discount for current Magic Pie owners. Would I be able to get this discount from your dealer Davinci Mobility in Liverpool? I would like to be able to take it back if the new one is slow like the first one. Or if there is any other warranty problems. Still a good motor though and I love the way it pulls up hills.
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Another nice feature would be increased space around the brake disc mounting area. I've got two sets of brakes and neither fit out of the box, I had to dremel a little material away from the MagicPie in order for the disc to screw down properly. (The inner material that "sticks up" closer to the axle was too close to the screw holes.)
Also, my brake didn't have enough clearance between the disc and the motor, it took very precise adjustment to prevent it from scraping on the "jet engine" pieces that stick up a bit further. (Or just lower the raised surface which would work too...)
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Hi Guys
This is my first post but I have been lurkingfor a while ;)
I have the 1st gen pie but am just building a bike for it. What have you guys done to get a good alignment from the offset of the rim? It seems to be around 15mm off. I am building a composite frame and rear forks so I can widen the spacing and put an offset on one side. I was thinking to put a torque arm on the offset side.
Cheers
Stan Woodman
Wolfe Island
Canada
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What have you guys done to get a good alignment from the offset of the rim?
Hi and welcome Stan.
This was my solution to the offset rim, but definitely not recommended for the faint hearted.
Click the photo if you'd like to see more details:
(http://goldenmotor.com/SMF/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1653.0;attach=1783;image) (http://goldenmotor.com/SMF/index.php?topic=1653.msg9193#msg9193)
Alan
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Another great idea would be to clean up all the wiring that comes from the front of the bike and bottle necks into a single cable near the Magic Pie. Instead of having to run four separate cables for the handle bar components all the way to the back of the bike, where they connect to a single cable anyways. You can create a connection point near the bars in possibly a small junction box or something that could be wire tired somewhere up front. Then from there the same cable provided currently (just longer in length) would run down to the hub motor. Creating the need for just 1 small cable running from the front of the bike to the rear. For people who will be hooking up accessories like lights or a horn, may have to run some extra wire to the back of the bike. The end result would still be cleaner and more professional looking setup right out of the box.
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Some info on when this new 72V MPII will be available would be great. I think I may hold out for this option. 72V would rock!
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well, not soon. as yao isn't able to respond to emails I think he also isn't working on a mpII
maybe next winter or so
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no no no... i'm just busy with something else, the exhibitions and stuff...
Anyway, I will be in London and Europe (Probably the weed legal amsterdam) Permanently from september 2010 to december 2013. So get your torque wrenches ready cause you'll be able to harass GM directly while i'm there. This way, I will be able to understand client needs and give direct feedback to the company. Also, we're still improvising on our quality, as you can see the quality of the MP has improved alot since the 901 kits, however, due to the complaints on the spokes and magic menopause issues (Kevin's bike), I guess there's still much room for improvements. Also, if anyone would be interested to become an affiliate, please get in contact with me as there is a huge market in europe, I plan to make oxford and cambridge universities my dealers as well, with discounts for students. Also, the soccer leagues, so I guess fans of real madrid will also get discounts??? I dunno, because it's still fresh. Yeh. :-X
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hi there yao yuan
if you do go to amsterdam,youll probably end up living there ;)..
would you be able to give us a date for the release of the mp2 please..
thanks again
Alex
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Also, if anyone would be interested to become an affiliate, please get in contact with me as there is a huge market in europe,
Hi Yao!
I sent you a message. ;)
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Yeah sure, i'll announce it here, the release date but it's probably going to be a little slow, cause we've still got testing and video productions coming up, as well as a brand new brochure.
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Hi Yao,
There are a lot of bikes in Amsterdam.
(http://deweersverwachting.nl/img/plaatsen/foto/amsterdam/Amsterdam_fietsflat.jpg)
Some facts
In Holland there are 18 million bikes on 16 Million habitants.
In 2009 1.3 million new bikes. 950 million euro.
10 percent of the new bikes is a e-bike
Erik
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It doesn't look like many ride them at night, judging by the angle of some of those headlamps.
Only one (out of the six bikes in the foreground) appears to be adjusted correctly.
Alan
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When you're riding on lighted streets, the
headlight is more to keep cars from running
over you than for seeing the road.
Pointing the lamp too high is better for that.
I sometimes wear one of those camping headlights
on my head backwards when I ride just so they
can't sneak up on me from the blind side.
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I got a 900lumens max brightness light strapped to my head and cars just start to do weird things like gettin out and jelling ad me :D
very nice those head lights especially the bright ones
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The changes are awesome. Great approach to speed control using regen downhill.
Will the BAC controllers receive these upgrades too?
The programmable interface is going to be excellent for the other motors out there.
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number guy, indeed. it will be excellent :D
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Great approach to speed control using regen downhill.
This was just a suggestion and unfortunately is not a proposed Pie II modification just yet.
It would be great if this suggestion could be implemented into a future upgrade of the GM controllers.(http://www.arhservices.co.uk/GoldenMotor/emoticons/fingerscrossed.GIF)
The programmable interface is going to be excellent for the other motors out there
....... when customers are actually able to make it work! ::)
It would be very nice to hear from anyone who has actually been able to alter their controller using the interface lead and the software from the site.
If this could be accompanied by a brief step by step explanation as to exactly how they managed to make it work, it would hopefully help others who haven't yet had any success with it. ;)
Alan
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What is the chips make and model? We can discuss how to get access to the code. The utility may not work but we still can try to download the data stored on the chip.
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I've somehow also managed to convince Philip to do another round of promotion. As well as an approximated 190USD offer to those that have bought the first Magic Pie. (I'm not sure about the cost price of this new Magic Pie)
This section of the forum is dedicated to this product and useful complaints/discussions of this product will be taken into consideration.
Thanks to all the members of this forum.
Yours,
Yao Yuan
Hello , Whew :o this sounds like a great idea ..Actually tons of great ideas .. Please put me down for one of the upgrade deals . I wonder if it will come as a whole kit or just a wheel or hub/motor to replace the one we have . I am guessing that the rest of the hardware and parts will work with the motor/hub??? Just a guess ...
It all sounds like good ideas ...who knows with the way you guys keep moving forward you might think of some more things to add before you start real production ...
Yup ... Put me down for upgrade #1 .. I don't see anyone else asking for "Dibbs" on that yet ;D.. Keep up the Great Work , Don J.
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Brake lights?!
How about modifying the brake levers, to be connected not only with the regen, but with the rear lamp? So if I pull the arms the rear lamp would light brighter like on motorcycles or cars!
It would be very useful!
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Some good news and some bad news of the Magic Pie II.
Bad news:
1)Volt limit lowered from 100V to 80V, Max recommended voltage is 72V. Anything over 72 will make it unstable.
2)Proposed function removed: Acceleration Adjustment in the programmable controller (uncertain)
Good news:
1)Magic Pie II would be stable for Dual Drive kits. Meaning that we will sell Dual Drive cables, making it possible for the noob to setup a Dual Drive mod.
2)Magic Pie II's spokes will be entirely different and will be machine made.
3)Magic Pie II would be available in more countries at a lower shipping cost due to the rising number of dealers that GoldenMotor has.
4)Magic Pie II "might" coming in 2 versions, the Street legal version, meaning topspeed/voltage of 25KPH/36V and the "other" version, 40KPH/36V.
5)Magic Pie II will be installed on a Full-Suspension bike, with a Dual Drive setup, fully customized and fine tuned by GM engineers. This Bike would be available at a dealer near you at an affordable price.
Yours,
Yao Yuan
N.B.Just a bad news from me: Too many pictures were taken at the ShangHai Bike expo, expect to see MANY dual drive bikes with integrated controllers next year at a super cheap price but with no after-sales service or warranty from MANY other chinese manufacturers. lol. I guess the dual drive bike attracted too much attention. I even managed to sell it at the end of the expo.
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hi yao
thanks for the mapic pie two updates...
i have a couple of questions
will the mp2 have the same sized controller,just with bigger voltage capacitors in it and being programmable.
basically,could I buy just the mp11 controller & install it in the mp1 motor and it should all work like a mp11 right.using the golden motor programmable program
I have just been out riding my mp1 high(speed version) with my new 55v lipo pack which comes to 62v hot of the charger..and I have to say today I am the happiest man alive..its a blast..
thanks yao..and thanks again for your time & updates
Alex
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Hello Yao,
Can you give an estimate when she will be ready for customers
Best regards,
J
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would you offer 1x MP 2 at discounted rate if another MP 2 was purchased ?
still unsure if I should get an 1 now so I can get discount on the next wheel
also are their any AU Dealers yet ?
shame about the Voltage drop .. I was going t o Combine 2x 48 V packs Guess i'll have to make 3x 24V now
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I think i'll make it fair, all at a discounted rate. no dealers in AU yet. but the law there is 200W...
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Will the dual drive consumes two times more power than a single drive?
Will you sell 72v batteries for the new MPII? And what will the top speed be if MPII running on 72volts?
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I think i'll make it fair, all at a discounted rate. no dealers in AU yet. but the law there is 200W...
http://www.aeva.asn.au/forums/forum_topics.asp?FID=27 (http://www.aeva.asn.au/forums/forum_topics.asp?FID=27)
Here's a link in Aussie land. Post an invitation for a dealer ship maybe. :)
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Basically, for Dual Drive on a MP II, you are able to configure the regen braking with the Computer Interface. I've been receiving reports about the Dual Drive with the MP I that the regen braking is TOO strong and grabby. Hence, with the MP II, you can test ride it first and decide how much regen braking you want, as well as the Peak Current, which supposedly controls the acceleration.
For me, my Dual Drive MP II was made for a top speed of 45KPH on a 48V, because my bike frame wouldn't be handle speeds higher than that. There will be a custom option in the new Order page when the MP II comes out, and you can choose to custom make the RPM to higher speeds. On a 72V, it can be made to be at 100KPH, but that will empty your battery really fast. Seriously, the point of Dual Drive is just to show off. Or if you have a 20AH battery, then perhaps you can use it for long distance transport.
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Thanks Yao for addressing this issue. Front wheel lockups at speed for any reason are dangerous and every possible precaution needs to be taken. The limit in speed on your own bike reflects your awareness of the frailty of common bike frames for voltage and speeds the Magic Pie motor is now capable. Stronger equipment to accommodate higher speeds seems not to be the next priority. Of course all these bike are for off-road use so we don't have to worry about a speeding ticket. The higher torque and speed, however, is allowing me to carry extra conventional batteries by trailer to extend my range of travel. The Magic Pie controller works wonders to maximize efficiency so that I can make a complete run with extra load and without recharging. The slower I go though the more load I can carry and the longer distance I can travel. Higher speed, even though more efficient, does not make up for the amount of power required to achieve the best motor efficiency. In other words realizing trip (distance and weight) efficiency is at the expense of realizing motor (speed) efficiency. Will be looking for the Magic Pie II sale.
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Hello Everyone,
Here is something we all have been waiting for. Philip has sent me 2 pictures of the yet to be released MP2. One is a 24 in MP2 wheel where you can see the new spokes and spoking pattern suggeted by Bikemad. The other is a 20 in MP2 that appears to be a solid cast and very cool looking. This is going to set the electric recumbent bike world on fire!
Gary
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WOW!!! :o
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I think i'll make it fair, all at a discounted rate. no dealers in AU yet. but the law there is 200W...
Still yet to know a cop that knows their enginering LAWS
also all that is needed is to throw on indicators/mirrors and the bike is road legal after inspection and can be registered as motorbike ( was going to make an 100km / hr bike but battery costs where to high .. I'll just stick with doing the large travel on the train )
besides they still have no way of testing them .. kinda just like the railway system .. they put us on Touch GO Cards ... stations are un manned and if someone does enquire for ticket You Flash the card and they walk away ...
any how I was planing on limiting the Bike using cycle analyst keeping high voltage Low wattage .. and by-pass it when I hit the Hill :P
I swear these hills should be illigal ...
as much I would love to sell these for you .. you have an Ban On E-Bay so their whent that idea ..
most people here have their 50/100 cc fuel burning chain driven motors thrown on their bikes
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Hello Everyone,
Here is something we all have been waiting for. Philip has sent me 2 pictures of the yet to be released MP2. One is a 24 in MP2 wheel where you can see the new spokes and spoking pattern suggeted by Bikemad. The other is a 20 in MP2 that appears to be a solid cast and very cool looking. This is going to set the electric recumbent bike world on fire!
Gary
Changes include center-alignment for rear wheel mounting as suggested by Bikemad. The steel motor ring and one hub side cover have neen changed to get the wheel aligned. This will make the installation much simpler and the existing V-brake can be used. We are here to listen your feedbacks which result in better quality GM products.
We sincerely apologize for the recent delay on shipping due to product upgrade and enhancement. Now we will build up stocks and ship out goods quickly to meet the customers expectation.
Now we have entire series MagicPie hub motors from 16" to 28" for most existing bikes conversion.
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I was wondering if any of the below suggestions were implemented in the Magic Pie II ;D
I did these mods to my two Magic Pie"s easly using a lathe and a 7 speed sprocket will fit also plenty of clearence for hydrolic brakes ::) and the hub is much better centered :D
I would love to make a Tricycle using 2 20'' Magic Pie IIs I think they are realy cool 8)
Magic Pie Needed SOME MODIFECATION in order to make coversions more easy with out the need for spaces for the sprocket and disk and this also got the wheel more centrol this is what I did see Photo's
on the sprocket side with this mode there is no need for the 42mm washer also a 7 speed sprocket will fit now and no need for spacers behind the disk The only extra washer that was added was an extra inner washer on the disk side but this could be eliminated later by buy extending the round part of the axial on the disc side ???
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Dear Who42,
Yes, your suggestions have been implemented into this MagicPie II enhancement. Thanks for your continuous support to Golden Motor.
I was wondering if any of the below suggestions were implemented in the Magic Pie II ;D
I did these mods to my two Magic Pie"s easly using a lathe and a 7 speed sprocket will fit also plenty of clearence for hydrolic brakes ::) and the hub is much better centered :D
I would love to make a Tricycle using 2 20'' Magic Pie IIs I think they are realy cool 8)
Magic Pie Needed SOME MODIFECATION in order to make coversions more easy with out the need for spaces for the sprocket and disk and this also got the wheel more centrol this is what I did see Photo's
on the sprocket side with this mode there is no need for the 42mm washer also a 7 speed sprocket will fit now and no need for spacers behind the disk The only extra washer that was added was an extra inner washer on the disk side but this could be eliminated later by buy extending the round part of the axial on the disc side ???
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Thanks Yao Yuan
Looking forword to the Pie Mk II ;D
Hope one day you get more into EV Car Conversions ;D
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The one piece mag wheel overcomes the problem of nipples breaking through the rim due to the absence of a nipple adapter to accommodate the extreme torque and angle imposed by the spoke. However, I was wondering if this modification has been made to the rimes which still use spokes so that damage to the nipples holes can be avoided or prevented?
Also on the the idea of centering the wheel to accommodate 7 gear sprockets. Its a good idea but I was forced to install a single gear sprocket on the older hubs to satisfy US law but I didn't care. A single rear sprocket makes the bike less cluttered which goes along with the idea of putting the controller inside the hub.
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Yao,
Please let us know when MP II will be available. Information widely needed.
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I am woundering why you still use Bicycle spokes ( that do not handle the torque at all )
why not use Motor Bike Spokes (twice the thickness ) with an Double walled RIM Bicycle wheel you can easily Drill them out a bit to take the thicker nipples and not worry about punchering the Tube as they sit below the 2nd wall
Just one quality and safty thing I can no seem to get my head around ...
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I am woundering why you still use Bicycle spokes ( that do not handle the torque at all )
why not use Motor Bike Spokes (twice the thickness) with an Double walled RIM Bicycle wheel you can easily Drill them out a bit to take the thicker nipples and not worry about punchering the Tube as they sit below the 2nd wall
Just one quality and safty thing I can no seem to get my head around ...
You say that bicycle spokes "do not handle the torque at all", yet there are many millions of bicycle spokes being used daily that would seem to contradict your statement. :D
If you could measure the tensile force acting upon a spoke of a conventional wheel fitted with a small hub and disc brake, you would probably find under heavy braking, that it is subjected to a tensile force of at least 10 times the amount of the average hubmotor spoke being subjected to full power.
Due to the significantly larger hubs used on hubmotors, the actual force on the spokes during braking is also reduced considerably.
Standard 14 gauge bicycle spokes (the thin ones) are more than capable of transferring the amount of torque generated by these hubmotors, and thinner spokes also help to absorb road shocks.
If motorcycle spokes are twice as thick, they will be four times as heavy and probably a lot more expensive too.
I also think that the larger head diameter of motorcycle nipples would be too big to fit down inside the narrow "V" of the double walled rims.
As far as safety is concerned, the 12/13 gauge spokes used on these wheels are more than capable of doing their job.
I would suggest that the weak point on most hubmotor equipped wheels is the sideways force exerted on the threaded portion of the spoke due to the excessive angle at which the spokes exit the rim.
This particular problem has finally been addressed on the MkII Magic Pies by achieving a much more suitable spoke angle.
If I were offered the choice, I would much prefer to have the thinner and lighter standard 14 gauge spokes in my wheels, but if you really want to fit motorcycle spokes to your rims, please don't let my opinion put you off. ;)
Alan
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While a 14 gauge spoke may not break under conditions of the extra weight of the motor and rear mounted battery in addition to motor torque and spoke angle the alloy rim simply can not handle the small nipple. A slightly un-tensioned "hammer jack" spoke and the rim will begin to spider crack from the hole. Try to keep your spokes tensioned.
If I were going to experiment though I'd look for ways to improve the nipple/rim contact area and angle. Perhaps an indented hole adapter would do the job. Once the rim starts to crack around a hole though you might as well through it away.
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Before anyone jumps to the wrong conclusion, I would like to point out that this is a serious reply to myelectricbike's post, and is not a job vacancy being advertised! ;)
If you have a problem with the rim cracking around the nipple seat area, then perhaps nipple washers could be used instead of throwing away the rim:
(http://www.chickencycles.co.uk/productimages/SR800.jpg)
With the correct spoke angle, the nipples should seat correctly in the holes, thus spreading the load more evenly to the rim.
Therefore a correctly tensioned spoke with a properly seated nipple should not cause these localised stress cracks in the rim that you have described.
Using thicker spokes (which are more rigid and have less give), will transmit more shock-loads directly to the rim, and in my opinion, this is much more likely to result in stress/fatigue damage to the the rim or the threaded portion of the spokes.
Alan
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Hello Yao Yuan,
Will it be possible to be connected via USB interface while operating?
That is, update parameters such as regen % on the fly?
I would love to have a trimpot on the handlebar to adjust regen level as I ride downhill.
Your changes , and the fact that you are incorporating some features we've asked for, is great, thanks.
Will the MP always have the "impeller blades" on the motor pointed opposite the spokes on the 20" cast version. Do they need to run a certain direction?
OMG, 90v, you guys are nuts!
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Spoke rim and nipple strength needs to suitable to the task
I ride pretty hard with a lot of weight with no back shock absorber. If I used a lithium battery and light full suspension frame mtb and rode on a city rode the original GM rim would of survived.
But I built a huge steal bike with no back shockies and decided to lug a ton of lead and shopping on the frame along a very bumpy road. 14 gauge and its nipple width would fail me soon enough.
Single wall alloy rim with 13 gauge spoke. Failed. Ding in rim and nipple pulls through rim
Single wall steal rim 13 gauge spoke. Success. Occasional spoke failure but was better with a lower tension.
Single wall, deep nipple well, alloy rim, 12 gauge, never had a problem since.
But the 14G spoke non-ebike motor wheel on my front is going fine with front shockies.
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Hello Yao Yuan,
Will it be possible to be connected via USB interface while operating?
That is, update parameters such as regen % on the fly?
I would love to have a trimpot on the handlebar to adjust regen level as I ride downhill.
Your changes , and the fact that you are incorporating some features we've asked for, is great, thanks.
Will the MP always have the "impeller blades" on the motor pointed opposite the spokes on the 20" cast version. Do they need to run a certain direction?
OMG, 90v, you guys are nuts!
Interesting suggestion.
I think the chip needs to be restarted every time you make changes to the parameters of the program. There is no reason the program cant be designed to do this on the fly but the USB cable is not needed for this function.
The older GM controllers had almost landed the perfect solution of regen off the throttle. All you would have to do is back off the throttle and regen would kick in, the more you back off the throttle, the more regen would occur. All that was needed was a way to switch it off or make the variable regen trigger off the brake switch.
The spokes should be faced in a direction to maximise aerodynamics of the wheel spinning. And the impeller blades are directed for visual effects and embossed into the surface I believe to increase internal air convection and oppose the air flow on the outside to improve thermal dissipation from the Pie case.
Even if you look at the tire of a bike wheel, there is an arrow pointing to the direction it should be installed to rotate. Reason being is wind resistance and tread irrigation flow. The smaller things don't add up over a single trip but over a few thousand KMs it all adds up to something worth building right.
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(http://goldenmotor.com/SMF/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1919.0;attach=2121;image)
Something's wrong with this picture?
You have the crank cog on the right side of the hub and the power cable loose on the right side of the hub and no gears.
Has this been doctored or this being designed to run in reverse. The spoke direction could be better faced the other way.
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(http://goldenmotor.com/SMF/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1919.0;attach=2121;image)
Something's wrong with this picture?
You have the crank cog on the right side of the hub and the power cable loose on the right side of the hub and no gears. A: No its the disk side of the hub with the cable and yes you would have to have one wheel revesed so that the cable comes out the each side of te trike and both gear cogs are on the inside ???
Has this been doctored or this being designed to run in reverse. The spoke direction could be better faced the other way.
yes it has been doctored ::)
I said I would love to make a Tricycle using 2 20'' Magic Pie IIs I think they are realy cool
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He he Good damn job there. :)
It looks like the same MP2 wheel in the first pictures but with a tire and the wire cropped.
I thought you were saying you want a second MP2.
This is where I got confused, ??? ??? ???
And I thought I was the only person in the world that has that sort of time to dreams up such things in paint programs (jke).
Seems I need to move over.
8)
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any how my newly made wheel has been finished I will see what it is like .. so far just about every E-Bike floating around here is falling apart from Broken Spokes .. aparently their were 5 E-Bike shops around here .. now all Gone bust .. and all the Cycle Places did not even want to put their name to re spoking an E-Bike due to all the spokes breaking after short persiod of time
It cost me $100 for an Rear Double wall RIM and $200 to get the motor Bike Dude to respoke it with motor cycle Spokes ... will see how it goes
for now jsut trying to hunt down a good stand for the miss's bike ... which I forgotten to do this week yet again !!
i think I have almost thrown $1k into getting her old 10 yr old supermarket bike retro fitted ...
only the frame has been left untouched .. E-Bike HUB @ Fron and upgraded the Rear to take Disc brakes ect ...
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Before anyone jumps to the wrong conclusion, I would like to point out that this is a serious reply to myelectricbike's post, and is not a job vacancy being advertised! ;)
If you have a problem with the rim cracking around the nipple seat area, then perhaps nipple washers could be used instead of throwing away the rim:
(http://www.chickencycles.co.uk/productimages/SR800.jpg)
With the correct spoke angle, the nipples should seat correctly in the holes, thus spreading the load more evenly to the rim.
Therefore a correctly tensioned spoke with a properly seated nipple should not cause these localised stress cracks in the rim that you have described.
Using thicker spokes (which are more rigid and have less give), will transmit more shock-loads directly to the rim, and in my opinion, this is much more likely to result in stress/fatigue damage to the the rim or the threaded portion of the spokes.
Alan
Where can I get these nipple washers? I've already lost one rim.
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Spoke rim and nipple strength needs to suitable to the task
I ride pretty hard with a lot of weight with no back shock absorber. If I used a lithium battery and light full suspension frame mtb and rode on a city rode the original GM rim would of survived.
But I built a huge steal bike with no back shockies and decided to lug a ton of lead and shopping on the frame along a very bumpy road. 14 gauge and its nipple width would fail me soon enough.
Single wall alloy rim with 13 gauge spoke. Failed. Ding in rim and nipple pulls through rim
Single wall steal rim 13 gauge spoke. Success. Occasional spoke failure but was better with a lower tension.
Single wall, deep nipple well, alloy rim, 12 gauge, never had a problem since.
But the 14G spoke non-ebike motor wheel on my front is going fine with front shockies.
Thanks for this information. I can get 12 gauge spokes for a straight hole 26" standard duty bicycle rim but I cannot get a rim with deep nipple wells, or 12 gauge spokes that will fit a 500 watt (or above) electric hub to a standard or heavy duty (trike) 26" rim. Where can I get these deep nipple well rims and 12 gauge spokes you are using?
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Where can I get these nipple washers? I've already lost one rim.
I found the nipple washers on www.chickencycles.co.uk (http://www.chickencycles.co.uk/index.php?cat=22&sub=83&ord=2). They are made by Sapim, so I presume they must be available from other cycle shops also.
Failing that I came across this:
I seem to remember a wheel builder a while back recommending spoke nipple washers in certain
applications. Can anyone enlighten me as to when these would be used and where to get them if
needed? Are they used on rims w/ no eyelets?
That might have been me. I use nipple washers under the nipples on rims without ferrules where I
know spoke tension will be high. It prevents pullout and fine cracks from developing around the
nipple holes. I see this happen a lot. I use aluminum washers with a 1/8" hole. I personally prefer
TRW pop-rivet washers. A box of a gajillion is about $5. Add 1mm to your spoke length calc.
Round washers may work with a single walled rim, but I don't think they'd be much use with a double walled rim, because they wouldn't fit through the larger outer hole.
Alan
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Any chance we'll be able to buy a Magic Pie II with motor/hall wiring for an external controller? Barring that, any chance of getting one without controller + wiring, to save a bit of money?
I always had a problem with my Magic Pie overheating and shutting the controller off, once I rebuilt it with an external controller it hasn't happened once.
It's the best motor I've found for providing enough torque for my needs without chewing through batteries, and now that it'll be aligned properly it'll be just about perfect.
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Failing that I came across this:
Yes, Home Depot stocks Arrow brand for $5 per 100 online plus shipping. Maybe they are cheaper in the store.
It just occurred to me all the work and down time involved but I probably should not put it off.
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Hello,
Please, anybody knows the total technical specification of the new Magic Pie II?
How many maximun ampers can work in 24V, 36V, 48V and 72V?
How many maximun rpm can work in 24V, 36V, 48V and 72V?
Thanks
Greting from JuanQui
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(http://www.goldenmotor.com/e-Bike-DIY/MagicPie Series.jpg)
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Wow!
Look at that Magic Family. ;)
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Spoke rim and nipple strength needs to suitable to the task
I ride pretty hard with a lot of weight with no back shock absorber. If I used a lithium battery and light full suspension frame mtb and rode on a city rode the original GM rim would of survived.
But I built a huge steal bike with no back shockies and decided to lug a ton of lead and shopping on the frame along a very bumpy road. 14 gauge and its nipple width would fail me soon enough.
Single wall alloy rim with 13 gauge spoke. Failed. Ding in rim and nipple pulls through rim
Single wall steal rim 13 gauge spoke. Success. Occasional spoke failure but was better with a lower tension.
Single wall, deep nipple well, alloy rim, 12 gauge, never had a problem since.
But the 14G spoke non-ebike motor wheel on my front is going fine with front shockies.
Thanks for this information. I can get 12 gauge spokes for a straight hole 26" standard duty bicycle rim but I cannot get a rim with deep nipple wells, or 12 gauge spokes that will fit a 500 watt (or above) electric hub to a standard or heavy duty (trike) 26" rim. Where can I get these deep nipple well rims and 12 gauge spokes you are using?
I use a 26" rim with the HBS hub. I got mine straight off an X5 crystallite. No it wasnt my x5. Someone owed me a new charger so he sent me a second hand one and some 12 gauge. The original GM spoke I have one here in front of me measured 168mm and next to the spar 12 gauge measures 165mm.
I use a deep well and they seem to fit fine. Prolly cause they don't stretch and they only need to be tight enough to stop the rim from moving around.
It was quite difficult to get them on the hub. Lots of bending. the result was a very hard wheel.
Ah Ypedal has a .com and got the spokes up here. Not sure they are 12 gauge but I think its standard for the x5.
http://www.ypedal.com/Products.htm
He's cool. Email him.
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I getting a 24 inch pie and hooking it up to a mighty little 24 inch MBT MX thing...... wow they look awesome.
(http://www.goldenmotor.com/e-Bike-DIY/MagicPie Series.jpg)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
SICK.
Can we get 100v fets please. ??? ??? ???
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Where can I get these deep nipple well rims and 12 gauge spokes you are using?
My bad.
Sometimes I make stuff up.
They are actually called deep v rims. You may have better luck finding them under the correct name. Sorry for any confusion. I got mine out of the trash.
(http://abbotsfordcycles.com.au/public/images/stories/rims/velocity_fusion.gif)
They add much lateral strength when laced taking the stress off everything IMO.
The Pie uses a similar rim. They are excellent and strong for their weight.
26" deep v rim standard original spoke pattern with 12 gauge 165mm length spoke worked fine on the HBS series. The angle is a bit weird but I havent even bothered checking since I laced her on. It just works
Where are you at and I can help you find something local?
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LOL... I was referred to round 1/8" ID Arrow brand aluminum pop-rivet washers. Found them online for same price in store but when I got to the store they had four hangers full of 3/16" ID. Local is never the way to go at my location.
Since I'm now checking spoke tension before and after each ride I think I'll be okay until I get a Magic Pie. My only question is whether there has been any corrosion on the controller or the hub since I've already lost 2 regular hubs due to internal corrosion caused by heating and cooling sucking moisture in.
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LOL... I was referred to round 1/8" ID Arrow brand aluminum pop-rivet washers. Found them online for same price in store but when I got to the store they had four hangers full of 3/16" ID. Local is never the way to go at my location.
Since I'm now checking spoke tension before and after each ride I think I'll be okay until I get a Magic Pie. My only question is whether there has been any corrosion on the controller or the hub since I've already lost 2 regular hubs due to internal corrosion caused by heating and cooling sucking moisture in.
I had that happen on one hub that I glue gunned the axle conduit hole air tight. Lucky it didn't go too far and I saved it in time. I think I lost a hall sensor.
I remember it was my first instinct to seal the hub from the evil water. Boy was that a new lesson learned.
You must live in a humid climate. I live in tropics of Australia and I was expecting it to happen a lot more.
Best to allow the hub to breath. I have these circuit board drill bits as thick a pin. You could drill a couple of drain holes on the outer most part of the hub face and put a cool sticker over it if the weather is really bad.
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Yuan.
If anything I ever ask of the engineers of GM is to use 100v fets. They can still make the hubs 48v and what not and set the on-threshold accordingly to these voltages.
The controllers will be a lot tougher in the event of a fuse blow or a loose battery connection. I know the fets you use are fine but us humans sometimes are not so good at things and we loose our gear with some easy mistakes..
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(http://www.goldenmotor.com/e-Bike-DIY/MagicPie Series.jpg)
Please Yao, anybody in Golden Motor could let me know the total technical specification of the new Magic Pie II?
How many maximun ampers can work in 24V, 36V, 48V? and could work 72V?
How many maximun rpm can work in 24V, 36V, 48V? and could work 72V?
Thanks
Greting from JuanQui
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(http://www.goldenmotor.com/e-Bike-DIY/MagicPie Series.jpg)
Available in May, said GM.
There is not much May left.
Any news?
Am I too eager?
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I thought the smaller sizes mp mkI should be available in may and the mk II takes longer
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I thought the smaller sizes mp mkI should be available in may and the mk II takes longer
whoa...I hope they are quick...
my handmade bike is waiting for MP II...
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Im personally awaiting better personal economy first. Since I got my pie, my better half thought it was so fun, need to order one more. I might get to use mine more.... :-\
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I am so sorry guys but the MPII is going to take a much longer time before it's out. Instability issues with 72V, reworked windings and reworked controller will cost us a lot of time. Apologies accepted? thanks.
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I am so sorry guys but the MPII is going to take a much longer time before it's out. Instability issues with 72V, reworked windings and reworked controller will cost us a lot of time. Apologies accepted? thanks.
This is certainly bad news.
The season in Europe is starting (started) just now.
GM, please consider reduced prices for MP I from now until the introduction of MP II.
Users will be unhappy if buying now MP I for the season with full price just the see introduction of MP II during the season.
Timing is always crucial.
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I am so sorry guys but the MPII is going to take a much longer time before it's out. Instability issues with 72V, reworked windings and reworked controller will cost us a lot of time. Apologies accepted? thanks.
From the stuff I learned from overvolting and trrying to rewind a HBS I knew this would happen. 24v to 72v is a very large range to handle.
As for the fet threshold voltages. You could run a tap off the logic through a 7805l on each fet giving a rock solid voltage at the gate through a npn transitor off ground.
Building switcher regulators taught me that between the switching fet and inductor there is only so much range to be had until the load over the inductor starts creating too much heat. The only way is to have another inductor onboard with a longer windings for the higher volts.
Anything is doable.
As for the motor inefficiencies at higher volts. You could have multitap coils or frequency adjustable PWM can certainly change the way things work in the motor. There are a few ways to skin this cat.
But anyway, we did win the San Fran slappity slapdown thing. I mean come on, MP was the only one alive. the rest couldn't even spin. lol.
I guess they can't announce this without strategic planning as it may cause other ebike makers to bitch bout it. It's literally and directly saying that GoldenMotor is the only one who makes good motors. So if anyone has any updates on this thingy, please link me to it.
True. The MP is a special motor. Philip does have everything from the volts to, frequency and duty cycle range of the PWM to the coils to all the GM motors in perfect balance.
Worried about some of the failures.
If GM sold 2000 MP motors from the site and the threads here represented a failure rate. this would be excellent.
Even someone in ES posted to me in my PM, I think it was dnmun, that a few over there wanted to know why GM gearless motor and controllers had the flying kick of Bruce Lee per efficiency. No no we arent x5 owners that ride 5 mile a day either.
Just from interest,
Yuan, how many MP's have been sold from the web site? I feel they are selling pretty good. Show us your hand here. MP sales figures can be something you promote as well.
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I think we won.
Your the man ATM where it concenrs this. You have more info than we do. Come back down to earth here and put some age into your post..
Maybe its not such a bitch as it takes time to publish stuff on the web. 5 years before I did ebikes I do web sites comercialy and this sort of thing takes time.
The site keeps saying check back after the event.
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http://slappityslapdown.com/Slappity_Slapdown/Press_Mentions.html
No news yet.
We don't know who won, gotta wait for the results.
Can we have some more details Yuan.
Please.
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http://www.slappityslapdown.com/Slappity_Slapdown/2010_RESULTS.html
Check again lol.
But heck, I have issues.
I can't do promotions or anything, it's a dealer thing.
Hence, i'm going to organize my first dealer promotion, hopefully. I hope the dealers don't see this, it's a surprise event ever since we won this 3 participant competition. lol.
but seriously, it's the first year.
Note: Imagine us winning this with only the MP1, which is no different from our first ancient prototype back in 2008. Now try to picture next year's competition with MP2? Also note, the only practical dual drive around since electric bikes were thought up of. I mean, yeah honda and harley, or even NASA has dual drive, but were they as affordable as ours?
Answers:
Ok i'm not really sure about the prices for MP1. It is certainly the cheapest and nicest kit around. But good things and hard to come by and we can only be patient. Whoops LESLIE, I sort of censored my own quote and yours as well, respect for the other manufacturers. Anyway, I think we did sell alot more than the number you wrote.
Anyway, I was thinking about the dual drive, and how awesome it looked on the bike, so I think dual drive would be the leader in this ebike thingy. I would personally like to have a dual drive MPII with a Black and White solid bike frame, and whoop ass in any competition or event, or just to attract the attention of ladies. I think the dual drive is the Lamborghini of the ebikes. Maybe I should race it with a jet plane like what the reventon did.
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News: Magic Pie II Dual Drive will be coming out before 2012
I CANT WAIT!! Now I just need to find more money lol
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I think they went overboard with the weight. Like I have hauled a lot more with my HBS but not up hils like that lots in a trailer. Nobody would want to ride bike loaded like that OMG. And that was the MP1. No programming to suit the task.
Think about it, if it is easy to program their controller one can use this to there advantage for the different tests.. This wil give GM the leading edge next year.
If anything it show the how much further the industry abroad has to go and how new this technolgy is. E-bike tech wasnt put into the too hard basket for no reason.
You know we forumer's work hard to help the new customers who now are in similar positions we were not so long ago and still are. Why do we do it. Because we love what we do new commers and old hands alike. We feel different, Just like the pie we stand out
I have much relief to hear you sell a lot more than 2000 motors and this makes any failures we see here look like an insignificant number. Many happy folk in the galeries.
I am so glad you have these forums and it shows the golden motor balls all GM excecutives, factory engineers and workers put out there.
I think if GM had a good investment of like 20 million dollars we would see less sinking very expensive oil rigs and a lot more green vehicles on the roads.
Keep hammering Yuan and the right person is going to get onboard especially with the setup you guys already have. You just got to keep your line in the waters to catch the fish. This is why I don't care about the pie looking so awesome and non stealth. People need to see this at work.
I think the slapity slap down was "hill'arious lmao. And the people running it are really geeky in a geeky way. See we are different. The results were confusing and the riders were quiet uncompetitive which was a relief.
I thought the single pie should of been better than the 9C on the hills but there was mention of the GM battery not giving the amps. The test was a test to make them all faill.
The 20" single pie would of kicked booty IMO but we will see next year, I do hope they continue this competition every year. We will see more contestants and divisions enter and soon we may see all the people in USA and those who can afford to travel compete.
Thank you for your reply.
And congrats to all who work for GM.
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thanks heaps for posting the testing you have been doing lately..
a couple of questions,
where all the different motors running on the same voltage??,+amps+,&rider weight,tire pressure..
maybe I missed that info somewhere
but would be nice to know
once again thanks for sharing this info..hmmmm
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Basically, for Dual Drive on a MP II, you are able to configure the regen braking with the Computer Interface. I've been receiving reports about the Dual Drive with the MP I that the regen braking is TOO strong and grabby. Hence, with the MP II, you can test ride it first and decide how much regen braking you want, as well as the Peak Current, which supposedly controls the acceleration.
For me, my Dual Drive MP II was made for a top speed of 45KPH on a 48V, because my bike frame wouldn't be handle speeds higher than that. There will be a custom option in the new Order page when the MP II comes out, and you can choose to custom make the RPM to higher speeds. On a 72V, it can be made to be at 100KPH, but that will empty your battery really fast. Seriously, the point of Dual Drive is just to show off. Or if you have a 20AH battery, then perhaps you can use it for long distance transport.
Does anyone know if the custom rpm option will still be offered when pie II comes out? also could GM possibly integrate the direct plug in cycle analyst into pie II, so people could adjust speed limit and amps without having to play with the usb cable. And does anyone know if the software will "actually allow" us to set the current limit higher than 14 amps?
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Another great idea would be to clean up all the wiring that comes from the front of the bike and bottle necks into a single cable near the Magic Pie. Instead of having to run four separate cables for the handle bar components all the way to the back of the bike, where they connect to a single cable anyways. You can create a connection point near the bars in possibly a small junction box or something that could be wire tired somewhere up front. Then from there the same cable provided currently (just longer in length) would run down to the hub motor. Creating the need for just 1 small cable running from the front of the bike to the rear. For people who will be hooking up accessories like lights or a horn, may have to run some extra wire to the back of the bike. The end result would still be cleaner and more professional looking setup right out of the box.
Yes please! I've been wrestling the $^#@! setup for 4 days so far...
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Sorry if this is a stupid question, but I am new here :-\ This thread is about the Magic Pie II, but ther is no mention of when it will be available, can anyone answer that ???
John
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Sorry if this is a stupid question, but I am new here :-\ This thread is about the Magic Pie II, but ther is no mention of when it will be available, can anyone answer that ???
J :)hn
Hi Aldby,
Welcome to the GM forums! ;D
I don't think the Magic Pie II will be available until the end of next year at the least!
Are you after Dual drive or the new pie II motor?
Mark
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Hi Mark, thanks for the welcome.
No, I'm not interested in the Dual Drive, I'm looking for a motor kit for a recumbent tadpole trike.
The Magic Pie version 1 and assumed V2, if available would be an improvement.
From what I have read on this forum, the current MP seems to have some flaws.
John
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Hi Mark, thanks for the welcome.
No, I'm not interested in the Dual Drive, I'm looking for a motor kit for a recumbent tadpole trike.
The Magic Pie version 1 and assumed V2, if available would be an improvement.
From what I have read on this forum, the current MP seems to have some flaws.
John
Hi John,
Yes the internal controller and the external controller does have flaws, But the motor itself is really good. If you get the pie motor wired for external controller, and use an infinion based controller from a non GM supplier. you will be very happy indeed. This motor has serious torque and I'm feeding it 40 amps @ 48-52 volts. I get 25 mph max speed. If you want faster I would go with a 72 volts.
At 60+ amps this is an animal and you really need serious torque arms to keep the axel from spinning in the dropouts of the bike frame!
I have not done any long term tests @60+ amps so that's up to you! ;D
Mark
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Thanks for your reply Mark.
I am no electronics expert and would really like a kit that works straight from the box, if the MP did this and good after sales service, then It would be serious option.
I have owned in the past a Bionx PL-350 powered bike which was flawless, but the kit is way over my budget for this project. I'm leaning towards a 350w Ezee kit. I have a lot of exprience with Ezee powered bikes and already have a 14Ah battery in my Ezee Forza. There is also good Ezee backup in the UK.
John
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i would also like to cast my vote for cleaning up the cables.
also a more slim-line thumb throttle controller with very small buttons for lights and cruise, one standard size brake button, and smaller LED battery indicator.
thanks! ;D
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Fully agreed!! Take my vote for these ideas too!
i would also like to cast my vote for cleaning up the cables.
also a more slim-line thumb throttle controller with very small buttons for lights and cruise, one standard size brake button, and smaller LED battery indicator.
thanks! ;D
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How can I see if the pie is the faster model?
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How can I see if the pie is the faster model?
There is no faster or slower model. The is a purpetual myth that keeps coming up.
Gary
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There is no faster or slower model. The is a purpetual myth that keeps coming up.
Gary, that's almost correct, with the exception of the 16" pies, these are wound differently to enable a much higher wheel speed (480rpm instead of 270rpm), but with lower torque.
Alan
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Thanks Alan, I forgot about that one! I'm just trying to correct the myth about there being different speed pies for the same wheelsize. I have however noticed after testing many motors that some pull more amps then others right out of the box. But once you use the USB cable to save settings they are all about the same. I guess that some have had the settings saved once already and others have not. Im really not sure of the reason.
Gary
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Big BUMP for this thread!
Hi Everyone, I hope all your pies are still fresh? ;D
Any news on the pie II ?
I think it would be really cool if GM made a hi power geared hub!
I think for the pie II they are going to give people the option of a faster wind, with less torque?
It's a shame you nearly always have to trade either speed or torque, that's why I would like to see geared hubs, and that would help cut the weight too, I know Geared hubs can have gear problems, but with the BMC that is really not a problem any more. I think MAC are coming out with stronger gears too!
Mark
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Big BUMP for this thread!
Any news on the pie II ?
Mark
Hi Mark,
As much as I say it, no one ever seems to agree with me. Alot of people, including myself have been riding around on the Magic Pie II for quite a while. The wheel is centered and has a programable controller that can be internal or external. GM is always improving and releasing new products and in the future there will be more improvments made. Also I'm sure in the future people will still ask "where are the Magic Pie II's" and at that time I will be telling them, "we are already riding around on what people should consider MP3." I am sure many at that time wont believe me either.
Think about it, If people were suddenly presented with a newer wheel with a new name, it would simply make eveything that already exists obsolete. I don't think it will ever happen. It wouldn't make sence to do it that way. I think we are more likely to see people in the forum in the future post something like. "I just received my new Magic Pie and its even better then the old one!"
Enjoy the Ride!
Gary
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Hi Gary,
Yeah that makes sense!
Yeah I am happy with my pie, but it would be nice to have faster speeds, And if possible without sacrificing torque! I would be very with 30 mph, but I guess I could always upgrade my battery in the future to 72 volts for maybe 35 mph, and without loosing torque?
I think I would like to be able to have 2 batteries, say 2 x 52 volt pings, and have the option of series or parallel connection to either give more speed or twice the range, I say 2x 52 because I would like the faster speed of a single 52 volt!
Magic Pie @ 104 volts? oh yeah muhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah ;D
Mark
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Hi Mark
Check this one out, 16 in Magic Pie at 88v volts 50 amps racing around with another over amped bike. Of couse this would void you warranty ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wwv-2wPjhQ0
Gary
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Hi Mark
Check this one out, 16 in Magic Pie at 88v volts 50 amps racing around with another over amped bike. Of couse this would void you warranty ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wwv-2wPjhQ0
Gary
Hi Gary,
lol that was fast indeed!
My warranty was void very quickly when I modded and fried my internal controller LOL ;D
I think 100 volts would be way too quick, But it would be cool to have the option of twice the distance or nearly twice the speed say when you are out in summer and you see a storm coming and you want to get home really quick! ;D
I don't think it's possible to have a controller to work with such a voltage range though?
Mark
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Big BUMP for this thread!
Any news on the pie II ?
Mark
Hi Mark,
As much as I say it, no one ever seems to agree with me. Alot of people, including myself have been riding around on the Magic Pie II for quite a while. The wheel is centered and has a programable controller that can be internal or external. GM is always improving and releasing new products and in the future there will be more improvments made. Also I'm sure in the future people will still ask "where are the Magic Pie II's" and at that time I will be telling them, "we are already riding around on what people should consider MP3." I am sure many at that time wont believe me either.
Think about it, If people were suddenly presented with a newer wheel with a new name, it would simply make eveything that already exists obsolete. I don't think it will ever happen. It wouldn't make sence to do it that way. I think we are more likely to see people in the forum in the future post something like. "I just received my new Magic Pie and its even better then the old one!"
Enjoy the Ride!
Gary
Ok but people would probably like to know when they can expect upgrade, not asking Magic Pie II but asking... when there will be a product on sale with this feature:
"1)Max volts accepted increased to 90V (accepts 24V, 36V, 48V and 72V)"
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so can a Magic Pie 16 "winding" be placed in a 26 inch casing ??/(Ginge thinks, dual pies, less torque, more RPM....hmmmmm)
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I'd say YES to that....
Shouldn't you be able to just swap the stators by popping them in and out??
I guess on the website you could choose 16" motor only and swap them over?
Lol get an external one, and leave the internal controller in the other one so you can swap them over :D
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After emailing with GM, there is no 72/90Volt edition available yet.
Does anyone know if there will be ?
And he also said that MPII was available, but there is no 72/90 volt edition.
Is there anyone who would explain how they have modified these controllers, or which they may have used. To achieve an 72Volt or higher support ?
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After emailing with GM, there is no 72/90Volt edition available yet.
Does anyone know if there will be ?
And he also said that MPII was available, but there is no 72/90 volt edition.
Is there anyone who would explain how they have modified these controllers, or which they may have used. To achieve an 72Volt or higher support ?
You will need an external controller capable of your input voltage, so the GM high end controller or an external (non-GM) will be required.
Do not exceed 50A current without expecting some heat issues. Magic Pie motor is most efficient ~50v
Either way... DO IT !!
lol
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Hello
High end controller, ? where do I find that one ? (much easier to order as much as possible the same place,if the price is right)
What voltage may it handle ?
Is it USB programmable ?
BAC0282P 48V/50Ah This one ? Or the 300/500Ah, expensive ones....If so,
WinXP software ?? Works with W7 ?
Heat issues in the controller ??
That may be handled, more aluminium or air.
A lot of questions here, maybe someone has some yes/no answers and I´ll be very happy.
I wanna make a fun bike for myself, the last one disappeared into the better half (just a little available once in a while).
Thanks a lot :)
Suprted1