GoldenMotor.com Forum
General Category => Magic Pie & Smart Pie Discussions => Topic started by: Supchrgamx on November 02, 2014, 12:42:24 AM
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can you use the vec300 on the bicycle motor ?
as well as the pro and cons of doing it
?
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I don't know if the VEC300 Vector controllers will work with a Magic Pie, but it might deliver a bit too much power for the Magic Pie without reducing its output by adjusting the controller with the program software.
The VEC200 controller might be a more sensible choice (assuming it is compatible) as it could still deliver more than enough current to cook the Pie, but it also a lot cheaper and would still allow up to 96V for much higher speed.
(http://www.goldenmotor.com/img/VEC200A.jpg)
Model: VEC200
Voltage:48V/72V/96V
Rated continuous current:80A
Maximum phase current: 200A
Motor control mode:FOC
Driving method:Direct torque control
Dimensions: 170mm(L) x 120mm(W) x 50mm(H)
Weight:1.9kg
I'll list some of the disadvantages first:
- It would require more expensive heavier duty batteries to deliver the higher current
- The motor would require much thicker phase wires to carry the higher current
- It would cost a lot more than the standard controller
- You would require some very heavy duty torque arms to transmit the torque
- The motor windings are likely to overheat with sustained high current usage
- Keeping the front wheel on the ground might be difficult
- The bike would be too powerful for street legal use (off-road use only)
- Bigger controller would be more difficult to mount
- Additional cooling might also be needed for continuous high power use
- The rear tyre won't last very long with all the burnouts
Now some of the advantages:
- Higher battery voltages can be used for higher speed
- Higher current means much more torque
- Fantastic acceleration and no need to pedal at all
- Front tyre should last longer as it will spend less time in contact with the road ::)
I'm still not sure whether either of these controllers would work with a Magic Pie.
I have already tried fitting the MP4 vector controller to a MPIII, and ended up with a two stage throttle which would only switch directly between "nothing at all" and "flat out", even though the throttle was twisted very slowly.
If someone has actually tried the VEC200 or VEC300 on a Magic Pie or similar motor, it would be nice to know whether it worked correctly or not.
Alan
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•Front tyre should last longer as it will spend less time in contact with the road ::)
I like that
I have two problems
I really like the vector , don't get me wrong
I think its set up, quite well, for a general kids bike
and I like the added bottom end torque of the vector
unlike a kid
I cant run around with twenty inch tires to get max torque
and I don't weigh 150 lbs
I killed a 15 ah 48v batt pack climbing a mountain, rising elev of 4400 feet
the bike weighs in at 77 lbs
I would say that we made it up 2/3 of the mountain or far enough up, to be able to see what the last third looked like
I need more torque and battery
the high torque output would be 10-15 sec bursts
higher speed not so much except that 30 mph I think is ideal
at that speed you can avoid pot holes and not worry about being slower than the flow of traffic
I don't know if you can limit top speed in a vec
laurence
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cant even find vec200
Laurence
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Hi Laurence,
Go to GM's website (http://www.goldenmotor.com) and click on the (http://www.goldenmotor.com/ItemBar%20BLDC.gif) button and then scroll down to find it.
Just look for 3KW BLDC Motor Controller.
I have no idea why the VEC200 and VEC700 controllers are not listed in the Motor Controller section. ::)
Alan
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hey Bikemad any idea the temp rating of the magnet wire or better yet the temp at melt down
Laurence
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Although I have pushed some reasonably high Amps into my Pie it has never been subjected to sustained high current for a long enough period of time to cause overheating of the windings, demagnetising of the magnets, or Hall sensor failure:
(http://www.arhservices.co.uk/GoldenMotor/MaxPower.GIF)
Unfortunately, I have no idea what the maximum rated temperature is for the GM copper wire used for the stator windings:
(http://www.arhservices.co.uk/GoldenMotor/RHsideview.JPG)
Alan
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friends of mine tell me for rc stuff 170 deg will kill their magnets
at 100 amps sounds pretty robust (tough)
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So Bikemad I have a question
the vec 200, do you know if the controller will switch fast enough to control 96v of power into the vector hub
or is 48 v better for what I want to do
Laurence
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As I haven't seen or tried one I have no idea of what they are capable of, but I wouldn't expect to reach 30mph on 48V with a 20" rim.
I think the question you should really be asking is whether it will actually work with a Magic Pie hub, but it's no good asking me as I just don't know the answer. ::)
Alan
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so what did the high amps do for you, compared to stock
Laurence
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The increase in torque really needs to be experienced to be fully appreciated. The acceleration was very quick and the front wheel would easily lift off (without pedalling) if full throttle was applied at low speed on level ground.
The tremendous torque even allowed me to perform one handed wheelies. ;)
Although the top speed was still around 25mph, the extra torque enables it to get there so much quicker.
The downside to all that lovely torque is that pulling away on slippery surfaces can be very difficult without the back wheel spinning about all over the place, and pulling away on grippy surfaces will easily flip you over backwards (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCpzXIPXdAQ&list=UUrrrMKZy5awZpOFcQWhmtiQ) if you twist the throttle too much.
I strongly recommend fitting some heavy duty torque arms when using large amounts of current!
Alan
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hey bike mad
golden motors say the vec 200 will not work on hub motors
do you know if the bac-0501 will work and if so are there any gain in torque from the internal
or do I just go for a lyen controller
Laurence
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Hi Laurence,
The higher Amps available from the BAC-0501 should produce a lot more torque, but as I don't have one to try I don't know how much higher the torque will be.
If anyone has any experience of using the BAC-0501 with a Magic Pie, it would be nice to have some feedback explaining just how well the combination works.
Alan